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No, my only RAID is external.
The power supply problem is one reason I keep a weekly completely
offline.
Your experience reinforces my belief that these systems are too
complex to mess with when it comes to simply getting up and running.
No RAID, no third-party boot loaders, just a simple MBR that is going
to get me into the system partition.
Let me play around and see what I can find out about the rest.
I am considering breaking my RAID and running it as two independent
drives. I would then think about putting a Secure Zone on one and
using the other for a secondary backup location. The reason is that,
once in a while, TI seems to have some problem cleanly or completely
disconnecting from the RAID setup. There is nothing wrong with those
drives at all, and the only time any error ever shows up in the logs
is after TI has accessed the externals. So I am thinking about
making that much of a change.
Yuki
Tuesday, January 6, 2009, 10:49:21 AM, you wrote:
JB> No, I meant restore an image file (from a WinXP pro system
JB> on a raid partition) back onto the same raid partition.
JB> Is your C: partition on a RAID1 drive? Or is it only your
JB> external USB HD?
JB> My computer HD system is organized as one small (75GB) and
JB> fast (10krpm) RAID1 system drive, and one larger (500GB)
JB> RAID1 drive for files, and backups. I also have an external
JB> eSATA/USB single (not RAID) 500GB HD for a global secondary
JB> backup location of all my computers. This external HD is
JB> only switched on when I do a backup. Otherwise I physically
JB> switch it off. (I have a friend who lost all his RAID5
JB> system and drives when his power supply failed an fried the
JB> computer). So, maybe your "Auto" setting has some use after
JB> all.
JB> I prefer to create an initial clean system install with a
JB> few applications as possible except for firewall/AV and
JB> updates, customized menus, folder locations themes etc. I
JB> back up this initial installation and keep it always.
JB> I did not change anything in the system. I had WinXP pro SP2
JB> installed on RAID1, and backed up regularly. Then a few
JB> months ago I tried to install SP3 and everything fell apart.
JB> I could not restore back the images I had of SP2, and spent
JB> 2 weeks trying to figure out where the problem came from
JB> (replacing everything from motherboard, memory and HD). Not
JB> much fun!. After restoring the image the system would not
JB> boot. I found out by coincidence that if I disable the RAID1
JB> in the BIOS my system would boot ok. The only solution was
JB> to start from scratch.
JB> Ever since than I am leery about my backups.
JB> I downloaded the demo version of the server version of IT.
JB> what I find disturbing is I can figure out how to specify
JB> the destination of the backup unless I use the "secure zone"
JB> partition (which I would like to avoid) and I can't figure
JB> out how to specify a secondary backup location if it is on a
JB> partition other that C: (I only can select a folder not a
JB> drive).
JB> If you have any info on these 2 items and it is possible,
JB> your inputs will save me some time...
JB> --
JB> Joseph Biran
JB> ____________________________________________
JB> -----Original Message-----
JB> From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
JB> [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Yuki Taga
JB> Sent: Sunday, January 04, 2009 12:18 AM
JB> To: J. Biran
JB> Subject: Re: [amibroker] [OT] Acronis True Image and system
JB> backup [was Re: Re: Curing AmiBroker slowdowns with a system
JB> restore]
JB> I have successfully restored systems from the RAID1 drives,
JB> yes.
JB> (You said "restore onto" but I think you meant "restore
JB> from", yes?)
JB> In fact, after many, many years (I think since 2002), I
JB> finally
JB> decided to do a clean install of XP. (Photoshop CS4 would
JB> *not*
JB> install, because of some legacy Adobe and Macromedia stuff,
JB> and even
JB> their tech support finally threw up their hands and
JB> suggested I
JB> reinstall the OS.)
JB> The first thing I did was to clean install XP to a virtual
JB> machine,
JB> making sure it was fully updated, fire-walled and
JB> anti-virused. Then
JB> I installed some key apps, including Photoshop and AB.
JB> There were
JB> absolutely no problems. When I had all my myriad custom
JB> settings
JB> matched in both the real and virtual systems, I backed up
JB> the virtual
JB> machine to the USB RAID setup, and with a full system backup
JB> there,
JB> too, (just in case) I attempted to use Universal Restore to
JB> restore
JB> the VM XP system partition to my real system partition.
JB> Absolutely no problems whatsoever. (It's been about 3 weeks
JB> now, and
JB> I haven't yet nuked the old system backup, but I'm getting
JB> ready to.)
JB> If your backup destination is a network drive, I suspect you
JB> would
JB> have to have the server version of the software, but I am
JB> not
JB> positive about that. Maybe not; maybe just the workstation
JB> version,
JB> but I doubt that the home version of Acronis will do it.
JB> There is at least one other thing I know that you might need
JB> to
JB> consider: The two versions of XP (Home and Pro) are not
JB> equal. It is
JB> impossible, for example, to install the TI Agent on Home
JB> versions.
JB> So you may have some trouble doing what you want
JB> network-wise if you
JB> have the Home version of XP. You can find a lot of
JB> information about
JB> this stuff at the Acronis site.
JB> I'm surprised you could even try a restore once you changed
JB> the RAID
JB> configuration. Usually, changing RAID configurations wipes
JB> all the
JB> drives. But maybe I did not understand what you did.
JB> The newest USB RAID setups can be configured to run either
JB> on 'Auto'
JB> or 'Manual'. And I don't even know why anyone would
JB> consider 'Auto'.
JB> The auto setting (it's a toggle switch on back of the unit
JB> with mine)
JB> means that the unit is powered up *ONLY* when it is getting
JB> a USB
JB> signal from the OS. Yes, this means that when you remove
JB> the device
JB> with Windows safe removal option, the OS stops sending a USB
JB> signal
JB> there, so the device powers off automatically, even though
JB> the power
JB> switch is in the ON position. I find this really odd. You
JB> have to
JB> switch OFF, then back ON to power up the unit again, or
JB> reboot.
JB> But booting with the setup on auto is an odd experience.
JB> Apparently
JB> the OS (or the BIOS, or something during boot) sends, then
JB> stops
JB> sending, then finally again sends a USB signal. So the
JB> device will
JB> shutoff, then come on, then shutoff again, then once again
JB> power on.
JB> Very disconcerting to me.
JB> More importantly, it seems to bother the Acronis recovery
JB> program run
JB> from a boot CD. If you leave the unit on auto, for some
JB> reason
JB> Acronis does not seem to see it until you power off and then
JB> power on
JB> again, being sure to power on while the "Loading Acronis"
JB> message is
JB> displayed on the screen. But in manual (drive always on
JB> unless you
JB> flip the power switch), it's apparently seen immediately by
JB> the
JB> Acronis program when it loads from boot. The problem seems
JB> to be
JB> that after initially getting a USB signal at some point
JB> during the
JB> boot (power to the unit then goes ON), the signal then is
JB> cut when
JB> the bootable CD is detected, which cuts the power to the USB
JB> unit
JB> just when you want the now-loading recovery program to
JB> detect it. No
JB> thanks; I don't want to play around like that. At first, I
JB> thought
JB> the recovery program was never going to be able to read that
JB> RAID
JB> setup, and that I had a real problem. But I finally figured
JB> it all
JB> out with a little trial and error, and the manual from the
JB> RAID gear
JB> explaining Auto and Manual. Default was Auto. As I say, no
JB> thanks.
JB> I just think I'd rather turn the drive off myself when I
JB> want it off
JB> -- one can configure these drives with either cache enabled
JB> (*potentially* better performance, but the possibility of
JB> data loss
JB> if you do a hot unplug) or disabled (I think my performance
JB> is the
JB> same because when my system is writing to that setup I have
JB> nothing
JB> else going on, so there is not really any need for the
JB> system to
JB> cache anything anyway), which allows you to unplug the drive
JB> without
JB> any warning or preparation, assuming you are not going to
JB> unplug it
JB> in the middle of a backup operation, of course. ^_^
JB> I've heard horror stories about Ghost, but some people swear
JB> by it of
JB> course. Since they insist on .NET now, I have no need to
JB> even review
JB> the product.
JB> Yuki
JB> Sunday, January 4, 2009, 4:00:35 PM, you wrote:
JB> JB> Yuki,
JB> JB> Did you have the opportunity to actually use Acronis
JB> True
JB> JB> Image to restore your complete system (bare metal
JB> restore)
JB> JB> onto the raid1 drive you use?
JB> JB> The reason for my question is that I was using Norton
JB> Ghost
JB> JB> and felt secure until I needed to restore my system from
JB> an
JB> JB> image I created (from a raid1 HD). It failed to restore
JB> to
JB> JB> the same raid1 drive but if I disabled the raid
JB> everything
JB> JB> functioned ok. I had to start reinstalling windows from
JB> JB> scratch in order to keep my raid configuration ;(
JB> JB> Also, does Acronis True Image work with a backup
JB> destination
JB> JB> that is a network drive? (this would apply to a backup
JB> of a
JB> JB> laptop).
JB> JB> --
JB> JB> Joseph Biran
JB> JB> ____________________________________________
JB> JB> -----Original Message-----
JB> JB> From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx On Behalf Of Yuki Taga
JB> JB> Sent: Saturday, January 03, 2009 4:04 PM
JB> JB> To: Lester Vanhoff
JB> JB> Subject: Acronis True Image Re: [amibroker] Re: Re:
JB> Curing
JB> JB> AmiBroker slowdowns with a system restore
JB> JB> Lester, on what do you base your claim that USB drives
JB> are
JB> JB> any less reliable than others? I've got a Buffalo twin
JB> 1-TB
JB> JB> in a RAID1 configuration, and I've never had a hint of
JB> any
JB> JB> problem. And a six-year-old Buffalo 120 GB USB is still
JB> in
JB> JB> perfect operating condition, other than the fact that I
JB> JB> cannot use it for an entire system backup anymore,
JB> because
JB> JB> of the size. (Thank you, 15 megabyte RAW files.)
JB> JB> Also, a tip for something I *finally* solved in
JB> conjunction
JB> JB> with Acronis and my backup configuration. For a long
JB> time
JB> JB> with this RAID setup, I was getting ftdisk or disk
JB> errors in
JB> JB> the System log, for about 1 to 2 hours after a nightly
JB> JB> backup was completed. Then the errors would stop (about
JB> 5
JB> JB> am in the morning). I could not solve it until I
JB> finally
JB> JB> looked at each and every item in Tools > Options >
JB> Default
JB> JB> Backup Options > Additional Settings. Unchecked by
JB> default,
JB> JB> is a line item: "Dismount media after backup is
JB> finished".
JB> JB> I checked that, and from that moment on I never had
JB> another
JB> JB> ftdisk or disk error in the System log. I should add
JB> here
JB> JB> that the errors did not mean anything -- the data was
JB> fine.
JB> JB> Oddly enough, as far as Windows is concerned, the USB
JB> drives
JB> JB> are still mounted in the morning. So the "dismount"
JB> must be
JB> JB> Acronis from the drives, rather than the drives from
JB> JB> Windows. But I think Acronis ought to fix this so that
JB> it
JB> JB> doesn't spit out dozens upon dozens of yellow triangles
JB> in
JB> JB> the log. (Why the default would be not to dismount
JB> prior to
JB> JB> program close, I cannot imagine.) They could overhaul
JB> that
JB> JB> interface, too. The sub windows (such as the one you
JB> get to
JB> JB> above) are much too small and don't stay sized, and
JB> resizing
JB> JB> them has an clunky feel about it. When I "drill down",
JB> I
JB> JB> like to see where I've been, as well as where I am and
JB> where
JB> JB> I'm going. ^_^
JB> JB> Excellent program however. I've accomplished numerous
JB> JB> restores and never had a bit or a byte out of place to
JB> my
JB> JB> knowledge. That's what we pay for: peace of mind.
JB> JB> I'll add that in your "the way it works" explanation,
JB> maybe
JB> JB> you forgot to say that one has a choice, too, of either
JB> JB> restoring entire partitions, or just restoring files or
JB> JB> folders. And in the later case it's sometimes just as
JB> easy,
JB> JB> or even easier, to simply mount the image and do a
JB> manual
JB> JB> copy across, than to sort through all the dialog options
JB> for
JB> JB> a restore.
JB> JB> BTW, I've always had an uneasy feeling about the Secure
JB> Zone
JB> JB> feature of Acronis. To me, that just adds one more
JB> layer of
JB> JB> complexity between a restore and the data. (If, for any
JB> JB> reason, TI cannot solve the Secure Zone -- that it
JB> exists on
JB> JB> the drive -- then I cannot see how it can possibly
JB> restore
JB> JB> the data that resides there, nor can I see how one could
JB> use
JB> JB> the OS to make that data visible to the
JB> JB> program.) So I never used it and still don't. But TI
JB> has
JB> JB> never failed to restore (never had an unreadable
JB> backup), so
JB> JB> I have no particular reason to think it might fail to
JB> JB> decipher the Secure Zone.
JB> JB> I just like to keep things as simple as possible.
JB> JB> Finally, I never bother to verify my images after
JB> writing
JB> JB> them anymore. First, I've never had an image that did
JB> not
JB> JB> verify, and second, according to posters on Acronis
JB> forums,
JB> JB> a verified image still is no guarantee that the image
JB> can be
JB> JB> restored or mounted. So I don't bother with verifying
JB> now.
JB> JB> (The verify process only verifies that *all* data on the
JB> JB> image can be read; it does *not* compare data on the
JB> image
JB> JB> with source data.)
JB> JB> Yuki
JB> JB> Sunday, January 4, 2009, 6:24:26 AM, you wrote:
>>>> I can take a product like this and save my complete hard
JB> JB> drive on say
>>>> a usb hard drive and it will automaticly backup the
JB> JB> complete hard
>>>> drive when ever I want it to do it.
JB> JB> LV> 1) The backup can be stored on your disk, in the
JB> secure
JB> JB> partition
JB> JB> LV> which is not visible to Windows XP / Vista. On the
JB> JB> screenshot below
JB> JB> LV> it is shown as "Logical Disk - Unknown (BC) and has
JB> no
JB> JB> drive letter:
JB> JB> LV>
JB> JB>
JB> http://img166.imageshack.us/img166/7749/01032009160435kv5.pn
JB> JB> g
JB> JB> LV> 2) Another method is to store the backup on an
JB> external
JB> JB> hard drive.
JB> JB> LV> USB drive is not a good idea because they are not
JB> very
JB> JB> reliable.
>>>> Then if I have hard drive problems, I can put the copy
JB> JB> that is on the
>>>> [external] hard drive on my machine hard drive and it
JB> JB> will be just
>>>> like it was, with all programs and files the same as the
JB> JB> last backup?
JB> JB> LV> That's right. The backup copy has it's own mini-OS
JB> (it
JB> JB> doesn't need
JB> JB> LV> Windows). You boot into the external drive (or into
JB> the
JB> JB> secure
JB> JB> LV> partition) and follow the prompts.
JB> JB> LV> My Windows XP takes about 8 GB of disk space and
JB> JB> restoring all this
JB> JB> LV> from Acronis secure partition takes about 4 minutes.
>>>> This type of software is something everyone should have.
JB> JB> LV> Absolutely correct.
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: Lester Vanhoff
>>>>
>>>> Microsoft's System Restore is very unreliable. It's
JB> JB> just dumb luck
>>>> that it worked for you. Consider getting a disk
JB> imaging
JB> JB> application
>>>> and do the disk image backup every day. One of the
JB> best
JB> JB> programs is
>>>> Acronis True Image, I've been using it for years. The
JB> JB> way it works,
>>>> when you get into a problem, it wipes out (formats)
JB> the
JB> JB> whole disk
>>>> (or selected partitions), including your operating
JB> JB> system, and then
>>>> restores everything from the backup image.
>>>>
>>>>
JB> JB> http://www.acronis.com/homecomputing/products/trueimage/
JB>
JB> ------------------------------------
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JB> This group is for the discussion between users only.
JB> This is *NOT* technical support channel.
JB> *********************
JB> TO GET TECHNICAL SUPPORT from AmiBroker please send an
JB> e-mail directly to
JB> SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
JB> *********************
JB> For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check
JB> DEVLOG:
JB> http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
JB> For other support material please check also:
JB> http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
JB> *********************************
JB> Yahoo! Groups Links
------------------------------------
**** IMPORTANT ****
This group is for the discussion between users only.
This is *NOT* technical support channel.
*********************
TO GET TECHNICAL SUPPORT from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to
SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
*********************
For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check DEVLOG:
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For other support material please check also:
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