Re: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies, oldies, ... and AmiBroker ..., AmiBroker Email List Archive

On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:34 PM, Keith McCombs wrote:

Dennis --
Your comments below reminded me of something I've always wanted for AFL. You called it an "AFL to English Dictionary", while I was thinking "Glossary". But, I believe, we may be looking for the same thing.

Many times I knew what I wanted but couldn't find it in the help documentation just because I didn't know what AB called it. For example, when I first wanted to plot multiple or different or other equities, all on the same chart, I was pretty sure that it could be done but had a hard time figuring out how. It was quite a while ago, so I'm not sure exactly how I tried to solve the problem. But I probably opened up Help and did a Search for 'multiple', 'different', 'other', or 'many'. Somehow, eventually, I discovered the 'foreign' function, which, by the way, took me longer than to write and debug my final code.

Had there been an "AFL to English Dictionary" or 'Glossary' with an entry like,
   "foreign() -- refers to symbols other primary symbol. Search - different, many, multiple, other."
it would have been of great help at the time.

Another hard one, at least for me, to come up with on my own,
   "AddToComposite() -- used to create composite indicators. Search - different, index, indicator, many, multiple, other.
and
   "ATC -- abbreviation for AddToComposite."

Note: Making such a glossary should not be very difficult. It would consist of:
1. Make a list of all the keywords, functions, and other useful terms in AFL.
2. Add very brief description for each. Best done by users with 'intermediate' experience.
3. Add Search words. Best done dynamically by newer users, especially those who had difficulty finding the particular keyword or function.

This could be a very useful addition to the UKB.

Oh yes,
   "Users Knowledge Base -- very helpful "how to" articles by users. http://www.amibroker.org/userkb/glossary
      Search - user, more, help, tutorial.
and
   "UKB -- abbreviation for Users Knowledge Base."
and
   "AFL -- abbreviation for AmiBroker Formula Language."

BTW, given such a 'Glossary' or 'AFL to English Dictionary', I see no need for an "English to AFL Dictionary". Just search for the English word that you think might lead you in the right direction.

-- Keith

Dennis Brown wrote:

Ron, and other posters to this thread,

This is a good example of where some of the problems in understanding come from. AFL is cryptic and concise. It takes a good long while to make the connection between a natural language _expression_ of the desired result and the AFL to say the same thing. I had ask for an AFL to English dictionary. You and other posters are asking for an English to AFL phrase book. I really like that idea. There are a large number of one liners that are very useful and are great at teaching how things work in AFL. How many times have I seen a question for "How do I plot a vertical line at x?" or "How do I change the background color by bar to indicate some indicator condition?". Almost the kind of thing that could make up an AFL FAQ section. This seems like one of the things the UKB was created to handle. However, each item is too small to warrant a wh ole UKB article in itself. The TOC structure is not set up for that IMO. However, having a dozen one liners about plotting, etc., in one subject would be very helpful. Just the fact that a number of question would be answered under one general heading makes it more likely that a new user would find the answer to the thing he wanted quickly.

I am hearing so many good ideas on this and similar threads in the last couple of days from new and old hands.

I am a great fan of "Cheat Sheets". Condensation of all key points to a subject on one page. There are many areas of AFL that could fit into this model.

Of course the problem with the UKB is that each article has to have an owner who is responsible to input and update its content. There are also some barriers to becoming a UKB author. Not big ones, but just big enough to keep busy people from crossing over. &n bsp;One suggestion was made to have AB support help out with that so there would be an easy as email way to make a contribution for these snippets. Support already has offered to post articles for authors, but I think it is still a barrier to have to write a "complete" article to post anything. Adding to an article that is already structured with a small think like people post hers would not be so daunting.

I think it is a great idea to have a topic related AFL phrase book. Of course it would also be appropriate for any UKB author to put up his hand and say he will sign up to maintain a particular topic UKB entry for the phrase book.

Perhaps if a few of us could take a topic and get the ball rolling, others would join in. The idea is that instead of writing a UKB article, you just email a snippet to the responsible person to add it to the article.

This list itself could be used to vet things first to reduce the editing of completed articles. That way someone would not have to be an expert to maintain one topic.

If several people like this basic idea, the we could expand the concept and create an outline for the subjects.

Should we start organizing the topics for a phrase book?

It is one thing to complain, another to suggest improvements, and still another to be willing to contribute to the suggestions.

What do people think of this idea, and contributing to it?

Best regards,

Dennis

On Aug 28, 2008, at 3:13 PM, <professor@xxxxxxxxx1.biz> <professor@xxxxxxxxx1.biz> wrote:

Ron,

The examples that you used were perfect. Even I could understand how they worked and learn how to do things that I wanted to do but didn't know how to do it. I spent a lot of time using barssince and ref trying accomplish this.

Thanks,

Tom

----- Original Message -----

From: Ronald Davis

To: amibroker@xxx oogroups.com

Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 11:36 AM

Subject: Re: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies, oldies, ... and AmiBroker ...

In the very early days of my Amibroker learning curve, The best help that I
received was from this board when an experienced user was kind enough to
quickly code an example or what I was asking.

Then, I would play with what they had given me, and I started to understand
how to use Amibroker.

For example, REF(c>ref(c,2),5); says that the close that happened five days
ago has to be higher than the close that happened on the sixth day ago.

Whereas, SUM(c>ref(c,2),5); only requires that any one or more of the
closes over the last five days has to be higher than the previous days
close.

The above examples of simple english explanations from this board are how I
started learning Amibroker. Ron D

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ken Close" <ken45140@xxxxxxcom>
To: <amibroker@xxxxxxxxxps.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 12:15 PM
Subject: RE: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies, oldies, ... and
AmiBroker ...

> Amen. Amen! AMEN!
>
> While Tomasz has done so much to improve and expand the training/manual
> since the early days (he really has!), the fact there is continual
> questions
> on the same stuff or "small stuff", suggests there is still room for and
> benefit from improvement.
>
> I am constantly reminded (or remind myself) that Tomasz has to say "Read
> the
> Manual". Some questions are almost obvious that a quick trip to help
> would
> answer the question, but o ther "simple" questions are not. Many of us do
> attempt to find the answers in help but cannot.
>
> For example, yesterday, I wanted to know how to make subscripted arrays.
> I
> did not remember that VarGet and VarSet was set up to do this. So a trip
> to
> Help and typing in "subscripted arrays" found 9 entries none of which led
> me
> to VarSet or VarGet. I think one of the improvements would be a search
> system which allowed more complex search logic or strings, or some way to
> zero in on the specific request. As Tomasz says, it is almost always in
> there, it just is hard to find.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxps.com [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxxxxxps.com] On
> Behalf
> Of Dennis Brown
> Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 11:58 AM
> To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxps.com
> Subject: Re: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies, oldies, ... and
> AmiBroker ...
>
> Brian,
>
> You are correct. I switched to AB because I wanted a programming language
> that was fundamentally tied into the realtime price arrays and the
> charting
> for the same. RT quotes --> Database --> AFL -->
> Charts. That was all I wanted, and that is pretty much all I use.
> There is a lot of overhead associated with getting and maintaining the
> data,
> interacting with the user, and outputting the the data in a useful form.
> I
> only wanted to be concerned with the algorithms that decided to buy or
> sell.
> Interestingly, even with all the support functions handled by AB, I still
> spend 80% of my time coding UI things! I think it is some kind of
> computer
> programming law.
>
> AFL was my real destination with AmiBroker, and I had a hard time because
> it
> was not well defined. A lot of assumptions were made about prior
> knowledge
> of specific programming language conventions in C like languages.
> Languages
> I had no experience with. These are middle level languages. My
> experience
> was with machine level assembler code, and very high level like
> Revolution/SuperCard/HyperCard, and a
> smattering of BASIC and APL from the original versions 40 years ago.
> I had no idea that I was supposed to go learn C syntax before I could use
> the AFL documentation. IMHO this is a documentation hole big enough to
> drive a truck through.
>
> Then what happens when someone has no experience with any programming
> language at all. Perhaps some Excel experience, or maybe experience using
> a
> programmable calculator. I can't imagine the bewilderment with AFL. It
> takes a lot of handholding from support or this list to get over the first
> hump.
>
> I believe it would be appropriate to define the AFL language in the
> documentation as if it were the only language that exists on the planet.
>
> For instance "+" is defined as "Addition". Whereas, in reality the "+"
> operator is data type dependent. It will add two numbers, add a number to
> every element in an array, add two arrays element by element, or
> concatenate
> two strings. It will not add a number or array to a string.
>
> As I have suggested before, I would have liked to see a "Complete"
> listing of all operators, functions, reserved words, syntax characters,
> directives, etc., in one live list index that points to a page that
> explains
> each one in the same way that the functions are now described. Then
> additional "see also" pointers on those pages to point to more in depth
> documents when available. In fact the current functions list could simply
> be expanded to do this.
>
> This would have saved me many weeks off the learning curve.
>
> I don't know if Howard is planning on doing this in his new book, but it
> should be part of the on-line documentation.
>
> Best regards,
> Dennis
>
>
> On Aug 28, 2008, at 10:34 AM, brian_z111 wrote:
>
>> I didn't explain myself very well there.
>>
>> What I am saying is that I think we are making it harder by not
>> admitting that it is a programmers program and just getting on with
>> teaching AFL.
>>
>> If anyone held told me that at the start I would have run for it but
>> the fact is that the help manual is about 'AmiBroker the program' but
>> eventually I came to realise it is all about programming -
>> specifically AFL.
>>
>> So, if I do want to get on with it where do I go?
>>
>> The AFL section of the h elp manual is condensed.
>> The first few chapters of Howards Book are a basic intro to AB and the
>> rest of the book is orientated around SystemDesign & Evaluation?
>>
>> Where is the next stop on the AFL line?
>>
>>
>> brian_z
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxps.com, "brian_z111" <brian_z111@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> Herman,
>>>
>>>> I always figured that sticking with AFL would have provided a more
>>>> continuous path for users to develop their programming expertise.
>>>
>>> This is a new point, not really discussed much before, I think.
>>>
>>> I really don't know how to put it in words but you are so right.
>>>
>>> Tomasz should be proud of me because if I am a programmer at all I
>> am
>>> an array programmer...... but sometimes I am left reaching for AFL?
>>>
>>> Perhaps there are co nventions that people with 2 or more
>> programming
>>> languages automatically understand?
>>>
>>> Do I have to go and learn C++ as well.
>>>
>>> Should I need too?
>>>
>>> brian_z
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------------
>>
>> Please note that this group is for discussion between users only.
>>
>> To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to
>> SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
>>
>> For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check DEVLOG:
>> http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
>>
>> For other support material please check also:
>> http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
>> Yahoo! Groups Links
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Please note that this gro up is for discussion between users only.
>
> To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to SUPPORT
> {at}
> amibroker.com
>
> For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check DEVLOG:
> http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
>
> For other support material please check also:
> http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Please note that this group is for discussion between users only.
>
> To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to
> SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
>
> For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check DEVLOG:
> http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
>
> For other support material please check also:
> http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>