|
PureBytes Links
Trading Reference Links
|
Hi,
Would it be feasible to work on the existing manual without re-
writing another document? The headings and information, as they stand
are already there, set out years ago by TJ and others. What is
lacking is a keyword search in newbie plain english.
Maybe a start could be made on the Function headings.
Peter
--- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Dennis Brown <see3d@xxx> wrote:
>
> Keith,
>
> Thanks for rescuing my post from the oblivion of the chaos that
came
> after it.
>
> I like your more detailed suggestion and yes we are talking about
the
> same thing. From a practical point, this is not something that
one
> person should have to take on by themselves -- it could be
> overwhelming. This is perfect for a collaborative effort
initially,
> but would require a Wiki sort of thing to do that in the broadest
> sense. Once it is all pieced together, it would not be too hard
to
> maintain in the UKB or in another way. Perhaps a text file could
be
> uploaded with the partial document and "checked out" to be worked
on.
> Eventually it would be complete enough to post as a good resource,
but
> of course would have to be updated regularly as AFL evolves.
>
> I think my extension to this is that I would like to see the
entries
> link to the place in the documentation that defines them, or
perhaps
> an auto search for references in the docs. Not clear to me yet
what
> would be the most helpful if they are not integrated into the
official
> docs.
>
> It would sure help to get started if Tomasz or someone else has a
> current text list of all keywords and tokens that AFL recognizes
to
> get started with -- that way nothing would be missed and it is
just
> adding info to each one.
>
> Otherwise, like you said, the first job to piece them together
from
> the various places in the docs.
>
> Any other ideas about how to make this a reality without killing
one
> person?
>
> Best regards,
> Dennis
>
> On Aug 29, 2008, at 4:34 PM, Keith McCombs wrote:
>
> > Dennis --
> > Your comments below reminded me of something I've always wanted
for
> > AFL. You called it an "AFL to English Dictionary", while I was
> > thinking "Glossary". But, I believe, we may be looking for the
same
> > thing.
> >
> > Many times I knew what I wanted but couldn't find it in the help
> > documentation just because I didn't know what AB called it. For
> > example, when I first wanted to plot multiple or different or
other
> > equities, all on the same chart, I was pretty sure that it could
be
> > done but had a hard time figuring out how. It was quite a while
> > ago, so I'm not sure exactly how I tried to solve the problem.
But
> > I probably opened up Help and did a Search for 'multiple',
> > 'different', 'other', or 'many'. Somehow, eventually, I
discovered
> > the 'foreign' function, which, by the way, took me longer than
to
> > write and debug my final code.
> >
> > Had there been an "AFL to English Dictionary" or 'Glossary' with
an
> > entry like,
> > "foreign() -- refers to symbols other primary symbol. Search -
> > different, many, multiple, other."
> > it would have been of great help at the time.
> >
> > Another hard one, at least for me, to come up with on my own,
> > "AddToComposite() -- used to create composite indicators.
Search
> > - different, index, indicator, many, multiple, other.
> > and
> > "ATC -- abbreviation for AddToComposite."
> >
> > Note: Making such a glossary should not be very difficult. It
> > would consist of:
> > 1. Make a list of all the keywords, functions, and other useful
> > terms in AFL.
> > 2. Add very brief description for each. Best done by users
with
> > 'intermediate' experience.
> > 3. Add Search words. Best done dynamically by newer users,
> > especially those who had difficulty finding the particular
keyword
> > or function.
> >
> > This could be a very useful addition to the UKB.
> >
> > Oh yes,
> > "Users Knowledge Base -- very helpful "how to" articles by
> > users. http://www.amibroker.org/userkb/glossary
> > Search - user, more, help, tutorial.
> > and
> > "UKB -- abbreviation for Users Knowledge Base."
> > and
> > "AFL -- abbreviation for AmiBroker Formula Language."
> >
> > BTW, given such a 'Glossary' or 'AFL to English Dictionary', I
see
> > no need for an "English to AFL Dictionary". Just search for the
> > English word that you think might lead you in the right direction.
> >
> > -- Keith
> >
> >
> >
> > Dennis Brown wrote:
> >>
> >> Ron, and other posters to this thread,
> >>
> >> This is a good example of where some of the problems in
> >> understanding come from. AFL is cryptic and concise. It takes
a
> >> good long while to make the connection between a natural
language
> >> expression of the desired result and the AFL to say the same
> >> thing. I had ask for an AFL to English dictionary. You and
other
> >> posters are asking for an English to AFL phrase book. I really
> >> like that idea. There are a large number of one liners that
are
> >> very useful and are great at teaching how things work in AFL.
How
> >> many times have I seen a question for "How do I plot a vertical
> >> line at x?" or "How do I change the background color by bar to
> >> indicate some indicator condition?". Almost the kind of thing
that
> >> could make up an AFL FAQ section. This seems like one of the
> >> things the UKB was created to handle. However, each item is
too
> >> small to warrant a wh ole UKB article in itself. The TOC
structure
> >> is not set up for that IMO. However, having a dozen one liners
> >> about plotting, etc., in one subject would be very helpful.
Just
> >> the fact that a number of question would be answered under one
> >> general heading makes it more likely that a new user would find
the
> >> answer to the thing he wanted quickly.
> >>
> >> I am hearing so many good ideas on this and similar threads in
the
> >> last couple of days from new and old hands.
> >>
> >> I am a great fan of "Cheat Sheets". Condensation of all key
points
> >> to a subject on one page. There are many areas of AFL that
could
> >> fit into this model.
> >>
> >> Of course the problem with the UKB is that each article has to
have
> >> an owner who is responsible to input and update its content.
There
> >> are also some barriers to becoming a UKB author. Not big ones,
but
> >> just big enough to keep busy people from crossing over. &n
bsp;One
> >> suggestion was made to have AB support help out with that so
there
> >> would be an easy as email way to make a contribution for these
> >> snippets. Support already has offered to post articles for
> >> authors, but I think it is still a barrier to have to write a
> >> "complete" article to post anything. Adding to an article that
is
> >> already structured with a small think like people post hers
would
> >> not be so daunting.
> >>
> >> I think it is a great idea to have a topic related AFL phrase
> >> book. Of course it would also be appropriate for any UKB author
to
> >> put up his hand and say he will sign up to maintain a
particular
> >> topic UKB entry for the phrase book.
> >>
> >> Perhaps if a few of us could take a topic and get the ball
rolling,
> >> others would join in. The idea is that instead of writing a
UKB
> >> article, you just email a snippet to the responsible person to
add
> >> it to the article.
> >>
> >> This list itself could be used to vet things first to reduce
the
> >> editing of completed articles. That way someone would not have
to
> >> be an expert to maintain one topic.
> >>
> >> If several people like this basic idea, the we could expand the
> >> concept and create an outline for the subjects.
> >>
> >> Should we start organizing the topics for a phrase book?
> >>
> >> It is one thing to complain, another to suggest improvements,
and
> >> still another to be willing to contribute to the suggestions.
> >>
> >> What do people think of this idea, and contributing to it?
> >>
> >> Best regards,
> >> Dennis
> >>
> >>
> >> On Aug 28, 2008, at 3:13 PM, <professor@xxx> <professor@xxx
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >>> Ron,
> >>>
> >>> The examples that you used were perfect. Even I could
understand
> >>> how they worked and learn how to do things that I wanted to do
but
> >>> didn't know how to do it. I spent a lot of time using
barssince
> >>> and ref trying accomplish this.
> >>>
> >>> Thanks,
> >>> Tom
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: Ronald Davis
> >>> To: amibroker@xxx oogroups.com
> >>> Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 11:36 AM
> >>> Subject: Re: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies,
> >>> oldies, ... and AmiBroker ...
> >>>
> >>> In the very early days of my Amibroker learning curve, The
best
> >>> help that I
> >>> received was from this board when an experienced user was kind
> >>> enough to
> >>> quickly code an example or what I was asking.
> >>>
> >>> Then, I would play with what they had given me, and I started
to
> >>> understand
> >>> how to use Amibroker.
> >>>
> >>> For example, REF(c>ref(c,2),5); says that the close that
happened
> >>> five days
> >>> ago has to be higher than the close that happened on the sixth
day
> >>> ago.
> >>>
> >>> Whereas, SUM(c>ref(c,2),5); only requires that any one or more
of
> >>> the
> >>> closes over the last five days has to be higher than the
previous
> >>> days
> >>> close.
> >>>
> >>> The above examples of simple english explanations from this
board
> >>> are how I
> >>> started learning Amibroker. Ron D
> >>>
> >>> ----- Original Message -----
> >>> From: "Ken Close" <ken45140@xxx>
> >>> To: <amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>> Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 12:15 PM
> >>> Subject: RE: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies,
> >>> oldies, ... and
> >>> AmiBroker ...
> >>>
> >>> > Amen. Amen! AMEN!
> >>> >
> >>> > While Tomasz has done so much to improve and expand the
training/
> >>> manual
> >>> > since the early days (he really has!), the fact there is
continual
> >>> > questions
> >>> > on the same stuff or "small stuff", suggests there is still
room
> >>> for and
> >>> > benefit from improvement.
> >>> >
> >>> > I am constantly reminded (or remind myself) that Tomasz has
to
> >>> say "Read
> >>> > the
> >>> > Manual". Some questions are almost obvious that a quick trip
to
> >>> help
> >>> > would
> >>> > answer the question, but o ther "simple" questions are not.
Many
> >>> of us do
> >>> > attempt to find the answers in help but cannot.
> >>> >
> >>> > For example, yesterday, I wanted to know how to make
subscripted
> >>> arrays.
> >>> > I
> >>> > did not remember that VarGet and VarSet was set up to do
this.
> >>> So a trip
> >>> > to
> >>> > Help and typing in "subscripted arrays" found 9 entries none
of
> >>> which led
> >>> > me
> >>> > to VarSet or VarGet. I think one of the improvements would be
a
> >>> search
> >>> > system which allowed more complex search logic or strings,
or
> >>> some way to
> >>> > zero in on the specific request. As Tomasz says, it is
almost
> >>> always in
> >>> > there, it just is hard to find.
> >>> >
> >>> > Ken
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > -----Original Message-----
> >>> > From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>> [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> >>> > Behalf
> >>> > Of Dennis Brown
> >>> > Sent: Thursday, August 28, 2008 11:58 AM
> >>> > To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>> > Subject: Re: [amibroker] Re: The best way to help newbies,
> >>> oldies, ... and
> >>> > AmiBroker ...
> >>> >
> >>> > Brian,
> >>> >
> >>> > You are correct. I switched to AB because I wanted a
programming
> >>> language
> >>> > that was fundamentally tied into the realtime price arrays
and the
> >>> > charting
> >>> > for the same. RT quotes --> Database --> AFL -->
> >>> > Charts. That was all I wanted, and that is pretty much all I
use.
> >>> > There is a lot of overhead associated with getting and
> >>> maintaining the
> >>> > data,
> >>> > interacting with the user, and outputting the the data in a
> >>> useful form.
> >>> > I
> >>> > only wanted to be concerned with the algorithms that decided
to
> >>> buy or
> >>> > sell.
> >>> > Interestingly, even with all the support functions handled
by
> >>> AB, I still
> >>> > spend 80% of my time coding UI things! I think it is some
kind of
> >>> > computer
> >>> > programming law.
> >>> >
> >>> > AFL was my real destination with AmiBroker, and I had a hard
> >>> time because
> >>> > it
> >>> > was not well defined. A lot of assumptions were made about
prior
> >>> > knowledge
> >>> > of specific programming language conventions in C like
languages.
> >>> > Languages
> >>> > I had no experience with. These are middle level languages. My
> >>> > experience
> >>> > was with machine level assembler code, and very high level
like
> >>> > Revolution/SuperCard/HyperCard, and a
> >>> > smattering of BASIC and APL from the original versions 40
years
> >>> ago.
> >>> > I had no idea that I was supposed to go learn C syntax before
I
> >>> could use
> >>> > the AFL documentation. IMHO this is a documentation hole big
> >>> enough to
> >>> > drive a truck through.
> >>> >
> >>> > Then what happens when someone has no experience with any
> >>> programming
> >>> > language at all. Perhaps some Excel experience, or maybe
> >>> experience using
> >>> > a
> >>> > programmable calculator. I can't imagine the bewilderment
with
> >>> AFL. It
> >>> > takes a lot of handholding from support or this list to get
over
> >>> the first
> >>> > hump.
> >>> >
> >>> > I believe it would be appropriate to define the AFL language
in
> >>> the
> >>> > documentation as if it were the only language that exists on
the
> >>> planet.
> >>> >
> >>> > For instance "+" is defined as "Addition". Whereas, in
reality
> >>> the "+"
> >>> > operator is data type dependent. It will add two numbers, add
a
> >>> number to
> >>> > every element in an array, add two arrays element by element,
or
> >>> > concatenate
> >>> > two strings. It will not add a number or array to a string.
> >>> >
> >>> > As I have suggested before, I would have liked to see
a "Complete"
> >>> > listing of all operators, functions, reserved words, syntax
> >>> characters,
> >>> > directives, etc., in one live list index that points to a
page
> >>> that
> >>> > explains
> >>> > each one in the same way that the functions are now
described.
> >>> Then
> >>> > additional "see also" pointers on those pages to point to
more
> >>> in depth
> >>> > documents when available. In fact the current functions list
> >>> could simply
> >>> > be expanded to do this.
> >>> >
> >>> > This would have saved me many weeks off the learning curve.
> >>> >
> >>> > I don't know if Howard is planning on doing this in his new
> >>> book, but it
> >>> > should be part of the on-line documentation.
> >>> >
> >>> > Best regards,
> >>> > Dennis
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > On Aug 28, 2008, at 10:34 AM, brian_z111 wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> I didn't explain myself very well there.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> What I am saying is that I think we are making it harder by
not
> >>> >> admitting that it is a programmers program and just getting
on
> >>> with
> >>> >> teaching AFL.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> If anyone held told me that at the start I would have run
for
> >>> it but
> >>> >> the fact is that the help manual is about 'AmiBroker the
> >>> program' but
> >>> >> eventually I came to realise it is all about programming -
> >>> >> specifically AFL.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> So, if I do want to get on with it where do I go?
> >>> >>
> >>> >> The AFL section of the h elp manual is condensed.
> >>> >> The first few chapters of Howards Book are a basic intro to
AB
> >>> and the
> >>> >> rest of the book is orientated around SystemDesign &
Evaluation?
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Where is the next stop on the AFL line?
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> brian_z
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "brian_z111"
<brian_z111@>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Herman,
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>>> I always figured that sticking with AFL would have
provided a
> >>> more
> >>> >>>> continuous path for users to develop their programming
> >>> expertise.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> This is a new point, not really discussed much before, I
think.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> I really don't know how to put it in words but you are so
right.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Tomasz should be proud of me because if I am a programmer
at
> >>> all I
> >>> >> am
> >>> >>> an array programmer...... but sometimes I am left reaching
for
> >>> AFL?
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Perhaps there are co nventions that people with 2 or more
> >>> >> programming
> >>> >>> languages automatically understand?
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Do I have to go and learn C++ as well.
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> Should I need too?
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>> brian_z
> >>> >>>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >> ------------------------------------
> >>> >>
> >>> >> Please note that this group is for discussion between users
only.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly
to
> >>> >> SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
> >>> >>
> >>> >> For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check
DEVLOG:
> >>> >> http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
> >>> >>
> >>> >> For other support material please check also:
> >>> >> http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
> >>> >> Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > ------------------------------------
> >>> >
> >>> > Please note that this gro up is for discussion between users
only.
> >>> >
> >>> > To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly
to
> >>> SUPPORT
> >>> > {at}
> >>> > amibroker.com
> >>> >
> >>> > For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check
DEVLOG:
> >>> > http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
> >>> >
> >>> > For other support material please check also:
> >>> > http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
> >>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > ------------------------------------
> >>> >
> >>> > Please note that this group is for discussion between users
only.
> >>> >
> >>> > To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly
to
> >>> > SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
> >>> >
> >>> > For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check
DEVLOG:
> >>> > http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
> >>> >
> >>> > For other support material please check also:
> >>> > http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
> >>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>
> >
>
------------------------------------
Please note that this group is for discussion between users only.
To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to
SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
For NEW RELEASE ANNOUNCEMENTS and other news always check DEVLOG:
http://www.amibroker.com/devlog/
For other support material please check also:
http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/
<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional
<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/amibroker/join
(Yahoo! ID required)
<*> To change settings via email:
mailto:amibroker-digest@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
mailto:amibroker-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
amibroker-unsubscribe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
|