|
PureBytes Links
Trading Reference Links
|
Bullshit !
Gram wrote:
> Suspect what you like. However, I trade regularly through European brokers
> on US and European markets, and I check slippage against my CQG data. Any
> profits I make are always deposited into my account, minus such slippage
> and, of course, commissions. Nothing else has ever been withheld.
> What is withheld, if anything (because you don't seem to want to say how
> much should be held), seems then to be held from the broker, certainly not
> from me!!!
> He must be a very generous broker not to charge me, what do you think?
>
> Gram.
> p.s. your last sentence is terribly cynical - perhaps you secretly like your
> fellow-traders being taxed heavily; perhaps it is your sense of justice?
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ------------------------------
>
> >Any account which is opened to trade on US exchanges is required to provide
> a US
> >tax ID # or the dealer(the brokerage house)has to pledge it's tax id #.
> >Accounts without a US tax id # are subject to a non resident withholding on
> ALL
> >proceeds and dividends. If the dealer doesn't get the information it is
> >required to withhold... if it doesn't withhold against the customer the
> >withholding occurs against the dealer account.
> >
> >I would assume you would have know these details. I really wouldn't take
> the
> >time to address these issues. Not being familiar with them seems to
> confirm
> >what one might suspect.
> >
> >Gram wrote:
> >
> >> Before I tackle your points, would you please explain this better,
> perhaps
> >> with an example:
> >> "You IB or BD is required to conform to non resident withholding or be
> >> withheld themselves"
> >> Many thanks,
> >> Gram.
> >> -----Messaggio originale-----
> >> Da: The Doctor <droex@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> A: gramario@xxxxxx <gramario@xxxxxx>
> >> Cc: realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> Data: 25/06/2000 20:36
> >> Oggetto: Re: [RT] R: R: Re: R: R: Re: Stocks and futures
> >>
> >> >You can't have a securities account or futures account using US products
> >> without
> >> >either a social security number or be subject to non resident
> withholding.
> >> If
> >> >you open an account at Schwab, Refco or UBS to trade in the US you have
> to
> >> >supply a US SS # or be subject to non resident withholding on dividends
> and
> >> >proceeds.
> >> >
> >> >Now I assume you are going to claim you use a non US broker. To clear a
> US
> >> >product they need to have a US sub which conforms.
> >> >
> >> >For example ... in securities and futures there are size position
> reports
> >> which
> >> >your broker has to submit. They either have to have a SS# or the
> brokers
> >> >SS#.... with an SS# the broker is subject to non resident withholding.
> >> There
> >> >are no exceptions.
> >> >
> >> >You can live on MARS it wouldn't make a difference. There are asset
> >> havens
> >> >once you have the funds ..... no income havens using securities or
> futures.
> >> >Even if your broker has an offshore sub or you trade through the London
> >> office
> >> >of a US member.
> >> >
> >> >Gram wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> First, I don't even understand what an IB or BD is?
> >> >> Second, I have no interest in US tax laws as they do not concern me.
> >> >> Third, the IRS is only one tax authority in the world. I feel obliged
> to
> >> >> remind you that the US in only one state in the world, not the whole
> >> world!
> >> >> If UK authorities do not/or cannot poke their noses into Sark affairs,
> I
> >> see
> >> >> no reason why US authorities should either. Further, surely any
> serious
> >> tax
> >> >> planning should also take into account other tax authorities also.
> >> >>
> >> >> Best,
> >> >> Gram.
> >> >>
> >> >> >I have a question? US tax laws require require non-resident with
> >> holding.
> >> >> How
> >> >> >do you avoid that. You IB or BD is required to conform to non
> resident
> >> >> >withholding or be withheld themselves. So assuming the story is
> correct
> >> >> how do
> >> >> >you avoid the w/h issue.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >Gram wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> Here: http://www.sark.net/~xott/sarkinfo.html
> >> >> >> But where you live is only one part of it, you must also organize
> your
> >> >> >> affairs properly.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> -----Messaggio originale-----
> >> >> >> Da: Eliot Kaplan <eliot@xxxxxxx>
> >> >> >> A: <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>RealTraders
> >> <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> >> >> Data: 25/06/2000 19:31
> >> >> >> Oggetto: [RT] Re: R: R: Re: Stocks and futures
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >Gram,
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >Thanks for your response!
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >I guess the next logical question is: Where (what country &
> >> >> state/province)
> >> >> >> >have you found that is so resident/income friendly that no taxes
> are
> >> >> >> >required?
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >My wife is Canadian, so I often ponder whether I could trade from
> >> there
> >> >> >> with
> >> >> >> >significantly less taxes.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >I could get residency through her, and have often considered
> >> Vancouver
> >> >> and
> >> >> >> >its environs a healthier alternative to Southern CA, which is
> where I
> >> am
> >> >> >> >now.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >The US with its ever increasing legal controls, taxes, pollution
> and
> >> >> >> >overpopulation have certainly got me looking at a potentially
> >> quieter,
> >> >> more
> >> >> >> >hassle free existence across the border.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >If only winter weren't so extreme!
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >Perhaps there are no "perfect" places?!
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >So, where are you pray tell?
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >Eliot
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >Eliot Kaplan
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >email: eliot@xxxxxxx
> >> >> >> >web: www.isu.com
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> From: "Gram" <gramario@xxxxxx>
> >> >> >> >> Reply-To: gramario@xxxxxx
> >> >> >> >> Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 17:43:06 +0200
> >> >> >> >> To: <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> >> >> >> Subject: [RT] R: R: Re: Stocks and futures
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Hi Eliot,
> >> >> >> >> I apologise for the fact that some people perhaps do not realise
> >> that
> >> >> I
> >> >> >> >> neither live nor operate from or within the US.
> >> >> >> >> I long ago decided that these costs had to be dealt with in
> order
> >> to
> >> >> be
> >> >> >> free
> >> >> >> >> from some encumberances. I made my plan (much as most of us do
> when
> >> >> >> >> trading), and then took steps to nurse and guide it to fruition.
> >> >> >> >> I have no interest in the IRS or any other institution and there
> is
> >> no
> >> >> >> >> reason why they should an interest in me..
> >> >> >> >> I am not a "declared tax free" as you put it; my position is
> >> perfectly
> >> >> >> >> legal.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> As to your question:
> >> >> >> >> "Do you not get audited and harassed by the IRS? There might be
> a
> >> few
> >> >> >> >> significant time, energy, and dollar costs in that, no?"
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> The answer is, "No, I do not get audited nor harassed by anyone.
> >> >> Hence,
> >> >> >> >> there are no significant costs (whether they be of a time,
> energy,
> >> or
> >> >> a
> >> >> >> >> dollar nature)."
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Gram,
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>> Are you just not paying taxes?
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> I presume this means you are among the folks who believe you do
> >> not
> >> >> need
> >> >> >> to
> >> >> >> >>> pay, that the Constitution or whatever "asks" for contributions
> >> but
> >> >> does
> >> >> >> >> not
> >> >> >> >>> and doesn't have the right to "demand" them. Is this so?
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> I've heard of the "declared tax free', but, like many, I'm
> sure,
> >> have
> >> >> a
> >> >> >> >> hard
> >> >> >> >>> time believing that just not paying would work, and not cause
> >> >> >> significant
> >> >> >> >>> problems.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Want to enlighten us on what you mean? And how long you've done
> it
> >> >> >> >>> successfully.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Your point about other trading costs being insignificant in
> >> relation
> >> >> to
> >> >> >> >>> taxes is clearly so, but I'm sure many of us have a hard time
> with
> >> >> the
> >> >> >> idea
> >> >> >> >>> we can just walk away from taxes with no governmental recourse.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Do you not get audited and harassed by the IRS? There might be
> a
> >> few
> >> >> >> >>> significant time, energy, and dollar costs in that, no?
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Just an interested citizen, and I apologize to the list that
> this
> >> >> >> inquiry
> >> >> >> >> is
> >> >> >> >>> perhaps off topic.
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Eliot
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> Eliot Kaplan
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> email: eliot@xxxxxxx
> >> >> >> >>> web: www.isu.com
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>> ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>> From: "Gram" <gramario@xxxxxx>
> >> >> >> >>>> Reply-To: gramario@xxxxxx
> >> >> >> >>>> Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 07:39:18 +0200
> >> >> >> >>>> To: <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >> >> >> >>>> Subject: [RT] R: Re: Stocks and futures
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>> So many people spend time comparing brokers commissions, data
> >> feeds,
> >> >> >> etc.
> >> >> >> >>>> which do indeed eat into their trading profits. But instead of
> >> >> >> >> concentrating
> >> >> >> >>>> solely on trading costs, look at it the other way for a
> moment:
> >> >> >> eliminate
> >> >> >> >>>> all tax, all accountants, all paperwork, inheritance taxes,
> >> Capital
> >> >> >> Gains
> >> >> >> >>>> and all corporate taxes and see what this does to your trading
> >> P&L.
> >> >> >> >>>> Try thinking of it as $1 earned = $1 kept. It is much easier
> to
> >> >> become
> >> >> >> a
> >> >> >> >>>> millionaire this way.
> >> >> >> >>>> If you save 30+% a year on such costs, the choice between CQG
> or
> >> >> >> >> Quote.com
> >> >> >> >>>> becomes easier. You choose the best there is for your needs!
> >> >> >> >>>> Just an idea.
> >> >> >> >>>> Gram.
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >
> >
|