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Paul - the behavior you are witnessing is a symptom of the situation where
the financial commitment of the user/customer has not been met adequately by
the commitment to quality by the supplier of the product.
There is a dramatic imbalance here.
I hate the bitching and moaning as well...but many of those types of threads
have kept me from wasting time or making the same mistakes....especially
when they refer to bugs or omissions or workarounds.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Paul M. Zislis [mailto:pzislis@xxxxxxxxx]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2000 9:43 AM
> To: HDD95@xxxxxxx; omega-list@xxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: Re: Please support your emerging trading software company.
>
>
> I, for one, am very pleased to see information about potential competitors
> to TradeStation on this list. If I felt that TS met all my needs or that
> Omega Research was interested in meeting my needs, I might not
> feel the same
> way.
>
> A lot of unconstructive bitching and moaning goes on here (as well as
> unconstructive defense of Omega Research). People like Mark Brown and Bob
> Bolotin who are trying to do something constructive ought to be welcomed
> here. (Although I would prefer a lot less Omega bashing from Mark - that
> horse has been thoroughly beaten already).
>
> IMHO.
>
> Paul Zislis
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <HDD95@xxxxxxx>
> To: <omega-list@xxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2000 7:07 AM
> Subject: Please support your emerging trading software company.
>
>
> > I have been reading this Omega mailing list for a long time.
> The 95 in the
> > email address HDD95 that this post is sent from is because I
> created this
> > extra HDD95 screen name in 1995 for the purpose of keeping the
> Omega list
> > emails separate from my other emails. Before that I was
> receiving the list
> in
> > digest form to my primary email address.
> >
> > My feeling has always been that this mailing list really isn't
> only about
> > Omega products. Rather, the more general topic of discussion seems be
> trading
> > software. This is an excerpt from an email I sent someone
> recently. I have
> > been trying to talk him into joining the Omega list, and he has been
> > resistant because he doesn't own Omega products:
> >
> > >>>
> > The Omega list is more than just discussion of Omega products.
> It seems to
> me
> > that the general quality of discussion in the Omega list is much better
> than
> > the futures trading newsgroups. My theory is that system traders have
> > migrated to this Omega list because they have something in common, which
> is
> > that they use TradeStation, but then these discussion forums take on a
> life
> > of their own. It is a critical mass thing. The common interest in
> > TradeStation has brought the Omega list up to critical mass, where now
> people
> > continue to participate based upon the life of it's own the mailing list
> > itself creates. Almost everyone I talk to subscribes to this
> mailing list.
> > <<<
> >
> > A discussion forum requires critical mass or interest fades.
> For example,
> > before the explosion of the Internet I was a long time reader of Club
> 3000.
> > This is a discussion forum similar to the Omega list, but instead of
> posting
> > Internet email messages, members would mail articles to the editor who
> would
> > compile the articles and mail the (paper) compilation out once
> a month or
> so.
> > It used to be the most active traders discussion forum around. Then the
> > Internet exploded and it seemed the quantity of articles in Club 3000
> slowly
> > went down and down. Finally my renewal came around and I didn't renew. I
> felt
> > that the newsletter had lost critical mass, and instead the hot
> place for
> > trading talk was mailing lists and newsgroups on the Internet.
> >
> > If readers of this mailing list do start to transition to TraderWare,
> > TradeLab, PowerST, or whatever else emerges in the future, and
> discussion
> of
> > these products is kicked off this Omega mailing list into
> product specific
> > mailing lists, discussion could become scattered and critical mass could
> be
> > lost.
> >
> > Of course, I am obviously biased here because I am the author of a new
> > software package in need of some exposure for my product. But
> think about
> > this. If you want to squash emerging trading software
> companies, push them
> > out of the forums which can give them the exposure that will help them
> grow
> > and prosper. If the topic of discussion in the most active
> trading system
> > software mailing list I have found on the Internet is
> restricted to Omega
> > products, it is only Omega products that will get exposure. Omega is the
> one
> > who needs the exposure the least, because everyone already knows about
> them,
> > and because they are big enough to afford the full page glossy ads in
> every
> > issue of every trading magazine. It is the emerging companies
> who need to
> be
> > nurtured a little by the marketplace if the marketplace really wants to
> see
> > some competition against the big guys.
> >
> > Year after year people have been complaining about the Omega products.
> Year
> > after year there are articles in this mailing list saying that
> there is a
> > need for competition in trading software. Finally it appears that some
> > serious competition is emerging in the form of TradeLab, TraderWare and
> > PowerST. And what is the reaction?
> >
> > Shut up, we don't want to hear about it...
> >
> > > You've already given us enough information about PowerST.
> If there is
> > > interest on the part of any readers they can visit your web site or
> > > correspond with you individually.
> > >
> > > I personally object to being forced to sort through a bunch of
> non-Omega
> > > related items, as do others, when that is not the purpose of this
> forum.
> > > Please carry on your sales activity in a more appropriate venue.
> > >
> > > Richard Funkhouser
> >
> > Where am I suppose to go to make contact and communicate with people
> > potentially interested in my product? I'm supposed to start a PowerST
> mailing
> > list and wait for people to subscribe? Besides, how am I suppose to make
> the
> > PowerST mailing list known if I'm not allowed to post to
> existing mailing
> > lists? How am I suppose to communicate to potential list
> participants why
> > they would want to bother to go to a web site to subscribe to
> the PowerST
> > mailing list? It seems like an impossible barrier for an new company to
> get
> > past. It would be a great policy to make sure it is extremely difficult
> for
> > any new product to ever have a chance against the established companies.
> That
> > is not going to promote the competition in trading software
> everyone keeps
> > hoping for.
> >
> > I realize there is a fine line between a product announcement
> and spam. I
> > don't think I crossed that line. I started with a single announcement
> > pointing to a web site. After that, all of my other postings were
> responding
> > to comments that others posted to the mailing list. If list members had
> not
> > expressed interest by posting follow-ups, I would not have make the
> follow-up
> > posts. I have no intention of continually posting product advertisements
> > unless there is either something significant to announce or in direct
> > response to interest shown by a list member.
> >
> > Of course, it is a mistake to view the list as a person. Rather it is a
> > collection of people with different interests and different viewpoints.
> >
> > This is a posting which was posted early in the same day when
> the PowerST
> > announcement was made. This comment encouraged me to go ahead
> and post the
> > announcement:
> >
> > >>>>
> > > From: Ray_Gurke@xxxxxxxxx (Ray Gurke)
> > >
> > > Normally I'd agree with you. I HATE SPAM. But, IMHO, this
> list supports
> > > traders and wannbe traders as much as it acts as a forum for
> discussing
> > > Omega products, problems and solutions. If there's another
> alternative
> to
> > > the Fabulous Furry Cruz Brothers snake oil and marketing hype, I for
> one
> > > want to hear about. But from now on, I hope the software speaks for
> itself.
> > > ..and if TraderWareX doesn't have it's own list, I'd suggest it start
> one.
> > > If the software turns out to be a viable alternative to Omega, this
> list
> > > will shrink dramatically.
> > <<<<
> >
> > (I am proposing that instead of product specific lists the
> subject matter
> of
> > this Omega mailing list be expanded to trading software products in
> general,
> > which I think has always been the case, but besides that I
> obviously agree
> > with the posting.)
> >
> > Also, this is a comment I received via private email.
> >
> > >>>>
> > I have read with great interest all of your postings both good
> and bad. I
> for
> > one appreciate the fact that you took the opportunity to post
> on the Omega
> > users site. It is obvious that there is a lot of unhappiness with the
> Omega
> > products and those unhappy customers should know that there are other
> > products out there that work. Certainly Omega management monitors those
> > postings closely. In the long run everyone will benefit by strong
> competition.
> > <<<<
> >
> > The Internet is an amazing media for someone developing a product in a
> very
> > specialized area such as advanced system testing software. As I said
> above, I
> > have been reading this mailing list for a long time. I have
> been listening
> to
> > what people in the list have been asking for in trading system testing
> > software. The Internet is now helping PowerST through controlled
> > introduction. I posted a product announcement pointing to a web site.
> People
> > can browse the detailed web site in as much depth as they are
> interested.
> I
> > have received immediate feedback leading to some posting of
> corrections to
> > the mailing list and updates on the web site. I have also received some
> > valuable feedback about priorities for future software features.
> >
> > Not only that, but the product announcement was not an
> announcement of the
> > release of the product. Rather, it was an announcement that the
> product is
> in
> > controlled introduction and additional controlled introduction users are
> > being sought. I would not have taken out a magazine advertisement to
> > publicize the product at this stage in it's release, but posting to the
> > mailing list seems to have fulfilled my original goals. I have
> made enough
> > contacts through private emails to keep the controlled introduction
> pipeline
> > saturated for now.
> >
> > Why controlled introduction? Sometimes someone else will paraphrase your
> own
> > thoughts better than you can state them yourselves. This is a comment I
> > received via private email:
> >
> > >>>>
> > I admire your forthrightness in listing limitations as well as the
> controlled
> > introduction you are doing to ensure the product is ready for prime time
> > before you make it generally available.
> > <<<<
> >
> > You want to shut down this Internet resource to emerging companies? That
> is
> > not going to promote the competition in trading software everyone keeps
> > hoping for.
> >
> > Anyway, this is my final post for the time being (unless someone else
> posts
> > comments I need to respond to). I hope I am not going to
> restart the same
> > conversation about list etiquette and whether it is or is not ok for
> vendors
> > to post articles discussing their products. Nobody wants to go through
> that
> > again.
> >
> > One final comment: I said in an earlier post that I was working on a
> "white
> > paper" about the topic of portfolio money management. When I was 2/3
> through
> > this paper I thought about it and asked myself, why am I going to post a
> > white paper which might elicit more interest when I have
> already received
> > enough inquiries to "saturate the pipeline" for now? So, I set the white
> > paper aside. I will finish the white paper and post it sometime in the
> future.
> >
> > Bob Bolotin
> > President, RDB Computing, Inc.
> > Developer of "PowerST: The Power System Tester"
> > www.powertesting.com
> > info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > 847-982-1910
> >
>
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