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even then zig will zag you.
superfragalist wrote:
>
> I wasn't talking about testing as in back test results. I was
> referring to testing to count phantom signals and plot distortion to
> determine the degree to which they might impact back test results.
>
> However, there doesn't seem to be any need to post any of the info
> from those tests since the issue has been totally resolved.
>
> Super
>
> --- In equismetastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com>, "mr. bryan mccormick"
> <deepfoobar@xxx> wrote:
> >
> > This from Jose, on the main failures of mechanical systems:
> >
> > "You use an indicator which uses future periods to determine its
> value (zig zag indicator is a perfect example)"
> >
> > That would make anything based on this suspect at best, and likely
> to produce results that are too good to be true.
> >
> > Simple.
> >
> > --- On Wed, 11/25/09, Doji <dojistarbullish@xxx> wrote:
> >
> > > From: Doji <dojistarbullish@xxx>
> > > Subject: Re: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MS 11 Pro with ZIGZAG in
> indicators
> > > To: equismetastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Date: Wednesday, November 25, 2009, 3:37 PM
> > > All the adaptive indicators in MS11
> > > use the ZIG function. Zig is
> > > forward-look and backtested results using it are not valid
> > > for trading
> > > purpose.
> > > Simple.
> > >
> > > pumrysh wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Bryan,
> > > >
> > > > Discussions about the dynamic nature of the zig-zag
> > > and their cousin
> > > > peak and trough indicators have gone on in this and
> > > other forums for
> > > > years. Most people decided to drop their use at that
> > > point in favor of
> > > > indicators that were valid and could be used in real
> > > life trading.
> > > >
> > > > Any indicator or system developed using these dynamic
> > > indicators
> > > > should be openly identified so that you can make an
> > > informed decision
> > > > about your technical analysis tools.
> > > >
> > > > Spyros Raftopoulos did produce a set of indicators
> > > that were somewhat
> > > > usable back in 2002 but even his work required
> > > validation which he
> > > > openly admitted. A great deal of that work was
> > > conducted on the "old"
> > > > Yahoo MetastockUsers group and there were a number of
> > > experts who
> > > > weighed in on the problem at the time. As I remember
> > > Jose(no longer a
> > > > member here) was only one of them. Others were Roy
> > > Larsen and Henry
> > > > Kaczmarczyk. Spyros went on to publish his work in
> > > TASC. You can find
> > > > some files about this in our files section.
> > > >
> > > > As for Thomas' statement that MS11 indicators use the
> > > zig indicator, I
> > > > cannot verify this. Joo Seng did point out earlier
> > > that All
> > > > "MS11-Adaptive xxx" indicators use the Cycle method
> > > and are based on
> > > > the zig zag. It should be a simple task to verify this
> > > yourself unless
> > > > the indicators are password protected. I would also
> > > think that Equis
> > > > would be upfront about the disclosure if it were the
> > > case.
> > > >
> > > > Realize also that Thomas did mention his use of
> > > "adaptive" indicators
> > > > and as Super has pointed out the question is what are
> > > these indicators
> > > > adaptive to.
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps,
> > > >
> > > > Preston
> > > >
> > > > --- In equismetastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com>
> > >
> > > > <mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com>, "mr.
> > > bryan mccormick"
> > > > <deepfoobar@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Wow. Well if this is true, I am not sure what use
> > > they could be. A
> > > > zig-zag is a backward looking indicator. As many
> > > people have written
> > > > in the past, not the least of them Jose Silva, systems
> > > based on
> > > > zig-zag will give nonsense results because of this
> > > backwards look. I
> > > > am not sure if Jose is still active. Perhaps I have
> > > this wrong. He
> > > > would be the correct person to comment.
> > > > >
> > > > > --- On Tue, 11/24/09, joo seng
> > > <jooseng6@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > From: joo seng <jooseng6@>
> > > > > Subject: Re: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MS 11 Pro
> > > with ZIGZAG in
> > > > indicators
> > > > > To: equismetastock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com>
> > >
> > > > <mailto:equismetastock%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > > Date: Tuesday, November 24, 2009, 1:00 PM
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Â
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > All "MS11-Adaptive xxx" indicators using Cycle
> > > method are based on
> > > > zig zag.
> > > > >
> > > > > --- On Wed, 25/11/09, superfragalist
> > > <no_reply@xxxxxxxxxx s.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > From: superfragalist <no_reply@xxxxxxxxxx
> > > s.com>
> > > > > Subject: [EquisMetaStock Group] Re: MS 11 Pro
> > > with ZIGZAG in indicators
> > > > > To: equismetastock@ yahoogroups. com
> > > > > Date: Wednesday, 25 November, 2009, 1:19 AM
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Â
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I've looked at the formula's for most of the
> > > indicators and I don't
> > > > recall any of them being based on zig zag formulas.
> > > Maybe I missed one.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > They have prev statements in them which slow them
> > > down to the point
> > > > where they have limited use, especially on intraday
> > > charts, but that's
> > > > about it.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > How an adaptive indicator performs is based on
> > > what it is adapting
> > > > too? Volatility, moving averages, money flow, etc.
> > > There are many ways
> > > > to program adaptive indicators.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Super
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- In equismetastock@ yahoogroups. com,
> > > "thomas12ng" <thomas12ng@
> > > > ...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hi,
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > I am surprise that the recent development in
> > > metastock 11 is
> > > > somewhat twisted.
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > After reviewing the indicator builder
> > > components (where all names
> > > > start with MS11 ; they must contain ZIGZAG parameter
> > > as their
> > > > proprietary arrangement. ) I feel sad about this set
> > > back. Mainly with
> > > > the indicator quality. I have monitored a few
> > > hypothetical porfolio
> > > > which system build based on these compenent vs. my own
> > > indicator from
> > > > a reliable "adaptive" indicator. The result is totally
> > > very very bad.
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > I truly have no idea who was the genius
> > > author behind these
> > > > repaint indicator.
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Just a quick suggestion: to those who try to
> > > develop system as
> > > > based on MS11 custom indicator just abandon it!!!
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > New Email names for you!
> > > > >
> > > > > Get the Email name you've always wanted on the
> > > new @ymail and
> > > > @rocketmail.
> > > > >
> > > > > Hurry before someone else does!
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus,
> > > version of virus
> > > > signature database 4632 (20091124) __________
> > > >
> > > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
> > > >
> > > > http://www.eset.com <http://www.eset.com>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version
> > > of virus signature database 4632 (20091124) __________
> > >
> > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
> > >
> > > http://www.eset.com <http://www.eset.com>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > > equismetastock-fullfeatured@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> <mailto:equismetastock-fullfeatured%40yahoogroups.com>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
>
> __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus
> signature database 4632 (20091124) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
>
> http://www.eset.com
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4632 (20091124) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
http://www.eset.com
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