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Well, I wrote "try to imitate", this means following experienced traders
without understanding why they do things. There are many traders, even on
this list, who can just look at a chart and know how/when to trade. But if
you ask them to put it into mathematical terms (or afl) they almost never
are able to do that. And that is what is mechanical trading is all about.
While I respect their skills their expertise has never helped me.
btw, Don't worry, you are not offending me at all ;-)
We could discuss this for hours but it won't change anyone's opinion, so
I'll let it be. We all have our own way.
best regards,
herman
-----Original Message-----
From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On
Behalf Of bilbo0211
Sent: July 31, 2008 1:25 PM
To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [amibroker] Re: Anyone actually making money?
Hey Herman,
I disagree with your comment about not learning from experienced
traders. If that were true, why would a newbie listen to any advice an
experienced trader like you has to offer?
At the risk of offending you further, here is another quote from the
trader with 20+ years of experience:
"Using the same trading technique and exit strategy in all market
conditions is likely to give you lots of practice at taking drawdowns."
While the website I am quoting from (daisydogger) is a commercial site
that sells trading information, there is some free information that
should be valuable for beginners. In particular the article that
describes a trading set up which includes how the trading parameters
were optimized and the article on adaptive trading (how to adjust your
trading to current market conditions). I wish I had that information
when I started, it would have saved me a lot of time.
Your suggestion that every newbie reinvent the wheel is likely to
result in discovering 10,000 things that don't work before finding one
that does.
Bill
--- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Herman" <psytek@xxx> wrote:
>
> I think it is a mistake for any beginner to try and imitate traders
with 20+
> years of, perhaps full time, market-related experience. These
traders didn't
> always trade the same way either, times change and so do the markets. If
> they are still trading they must have adapted many times. They
probably have
> developed skills that they can't communicate and that they
themselves may
> not even be aware of. Listening too carefull to anyone, without
having the
> same background, is going to cost you money. Big money if you take
them too
> serious. I speak from experience. Only if you do your own thing will you
> understand your actions and be a responsible trader. And, don't jump
in with
> big money. There is no shame in trading 1 share to prove a system.
>
> Take it easy, experiment, sit back and look at charts, try coding some
> simple systems. Remember: It's got to be fun! Trading system do not
have to
> be complicated. The best systems use simple techniques, with perhaps
just a
> dozen of AFL lines at most. Much the the coding complexities you see
> discussed here have little or nothing to do with developing a trading
> principle. Testing systems, even if they don't make money, will reveal
> things about the market that no amount of chart/tape reading can
teach you.
> Sooner or later you'll have a reportoire of simple ideas that you can
> trade - that will be the time that you start posting on this list for
> programming help :-)
>
> AmiBroker will not make money for you but it is (imo) the best
development
> tool around.
>
> Happy development,
> herman
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]On
> Behalf Of Paul Ho
> Sent: July 31, 2008 9:49 AM
> To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [amibroker] Re: Anyone actually making money?
>
>
> I'm still waiting for your to say something sensible, that's of value,
> > rather than just dig everyone out...???
>
> LOL, I just told you. YOu cant become a good trader until you know
> yourself, really know yourself. Knowing how to draw a few lines makes
> you a TA guy, not a trader. understanding the market makes you a
> market analyst. Even know how to develop a system doesnt make you a
> trader either, you are merely a system developer. When you master
> yourself, you are on your way to become a real trader.
> Just because you've been involved in trading for years, seeing others
> making millions, no more makes your a trader than me an olympian just
> because I've been watching olypmics for the last 45 years.
> You might think I'm slagging you off, but in years to come, you will
> find out for yourself whats true.
>
> --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "sidhartha70" <sidhartha70@>
> wrote:
> >
> > Paul,
> >
> > I programme too... nothing wrong with programming and making your
> life
> > easier. And nothing wrong with asking for someone to 'throw you a
> > bone' in that goal... I'm new to AFL. So what??
> >
> > I've been involved in trading for many years... market making, index
> > arbitrage, statistical arbitrage, long/short prop etc.. many years.
> > And some of the best money makers I've ever seen have been traders,
> > not system traders, who genuinely have a great read of the market
> > based off tape reading skills... they have achieved returns,
> > consistently, that systems traders can only dream of...
> >
> > I've traded both... systems and otherwise... you can programme all
> the
> > most complicated indictaors you like... they are all based on the
> same
> > things tape reading is... which is price & volume action...
> >
> > I'm still waiting for your to say something sensible, that's of
> value,
> > rather than just dig everyone out...???
> >
> > --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Paul Ho" <paul.tsho@> wrote:
> > >
> > > learn everything you can
> > > about trendlines, support & resistance and the old tape reading
> skills
> > > and you will be miles ahead of 'system developers' in terms of
> > > actually understanding the markets and becoming a better trader.
> > > .......
> > > So you think understanding a few lines on the chart you will
> become
> > a better
> > > trader!!!
> > > So you think understanding the market will make you a better
> trader!!!
> > > So you think you are miles ahead just because you know how to
> draw a
> > lines
> > > rather than a system trader who write a few hundred lines of
> codes.
> > > NONE OF THE ABOVE WILL MAKE YOU A GOOD TRADER
> > > YOU WILL ONLY BECOME A GOOD TRADER IF YOU KNOW YOUSELF.
> > >
> > > I'LL KEEP THIS IN A SAFE PLACE AND USE IT AS A REPLY WHEN YOU ASK
> > SOMEONE TO
> > > THROW YOU A BONE.
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > From: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
> > > On Behalf Of sidhartha70
> > > Sent: Thursday, 31 July 2008 10:47 PM
> > > To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > Subject: [amibroker] Re: Anyone actually making money?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Louis,
> > >
> > > Here's my tip... worth it's weight in gold. I've been doing
> this for
> > > a
> > > long time...
> > >
> > > Stop looking for the holy grail system... learn everything
> you can
> > > about trendlines, support & resistance and the old tape
> reading
> > > skills
> > > and you will be miles ahead of 'system developers' in terms of
> > > actually understanding the markets and becoming a better
> trader.
> > >
> > > Too many people spend far too much time trying to develop
> a 'system'
> > > rather than becoming a better trader.
> > >
> > > --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > <mailto:amibroker%40yahoogroups.com> , "Louis P." <rockprog80@>
> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > > I was only wondering... Anyone actually making money or
> making a
> > > living
> > > > with AB and trading?
> > > >
> > > > I've been working on ideas and plans for over 7 months now
> and
> > > didn't find
> > > > anything convincing yet. I've been searching daily data,
> then
> > > hourly,
> > > > 15-minute and now I am into 1-minute data and nothing seems
> > > satisfying.
> > > > Been searching RSI, MFI, ADX, MA, HHV, LLV... nothing seems
> to
> > > work.
> > > >
> > > > So... Anyone is making consistent money with this, and if
> so, at
> > > which
> > > > timeframe and how do you do it?
> > > >
> > > > I'm beginning to think about switching to tick database; it
> seems
> > > even
> > > > 1-minute is too slow for intraday trading. Anyone making
> money
> > > with
> > > > 1-minute?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >
> > > > Louis
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
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Please note that this group is for discussion between users only.
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Please note that this group is for discussion between users only.
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