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They are the kinds of things that the "I don't ever wanna be a
programmer types" wouldn't use any way ...
--- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, RajeevM <rajeevmundra@xxx> wrote:
>
> Yes
>
> The direction AMI needs now (in my view) is to make the powerful
horse work
> for the technical fools. (people who cant code etc).
>
> If this is done, the Ami's shine would get exponential.
>
> I can imagine that for people like thomaz its hard to
imagine, "whats
> complex in ami"..!!
>
> Please create a poll.. ( Online in yahoo groups) or else where and
ask what
> 'complex things' would people like to have a little more easier.
>
> regards
> Rajeev
>
>
> On 10/16/06, brian.z123 <brian.z123@xxx> wrote:
> >
> > Hello Jlami11,
> >
> > The virtues of AB are often extolled in this forum (along with the
> > vices) but I don't think I have seen a post that even goes close
to
> > doing it justice.
> > Tomasz is too modest to list all the good points in one place
> > himself, although God knows that after 100k posts it is well
overdue.
> > Here is my attempt that will have to suffice until bettered.
> >
> >
*******************************************************************
> > Conclusion:
> >
> > The bad news is that it takes a lot of patience to master
AmiBroker,
> > especially for those who are not seasoned traders/programmers.
> > The good new is that it is worth the effort.
> > If there is a better program out there Tomasz would have known
about
> > it a long time ago ;-)
> >
> > (If you are in a hurry skip to list at the bottom of the post).
> >
> >
*******************************************************************
> >
> > An interesting question.
> > As a relatively new Ami user I can empathise with you.
> > Keep in mind that there is no *holy grail* of software or anything
> > else in trading.
> > Also my only intention is to offer help to you and give credit to
> > AmiBroker where it is due.
> >
> > What you are really asking is; "Will AmiBroker be worth the time I
> > will have to put in to learn it, will I be capable of learning it
> > and what will I be able to do with it when I am competent?",
> > (that is like looking for your glasses!).
> > Ultimately you are the only one who can answer that.
> >
> > You need to clarify how serious you are about trading and clearly
> > state your trading objectives to yourself first.
> > I am continually amazed by the number of people who come into this
> > forum and who, presumably, want to be winning traders, but
obviously
> > do not have a winning attitude (I am not suggesting that is you. I
> > am simply providing some context to my comments).
> > If that is the case they can not blame the software for their
> > eventual and inevitable failure.
> >
> >
> > My experiences may provide some guideance for you.
> >
> > I am a non-programmer, non-mathematician and a self-taught
computer
> > layperson.
> > I do not have a tertiary education.
> > I am probably of above average intelligence but I don't know
exactly
> > where I am on that line and I have no interest in finding out.
> > Fortunately I do have abilities and talents of some kind that get
me
> > by, althoguh I am not sure exactly what they are either.
> >
> > Four years ago I had zero experience in investment of any kind
when
> > I set myself very high investment goals.
> > I will rephrase the last part; I knew specifically what I wanted
to
> > achieve as an investor (if the format would allow it I would bold
or
> > underline specifically, as in, the % return I am going to get and
> > the hours per week I am going to get it in).
> > After the intitial learning phase I also quickly identified what
> > investment styles I *believed* in and which ones suited my
personal
> > characterstics and objectives e.g. I don't want to spend hours
> > reading company reports, financials etc so I went away from that
> > type of trading.
> > Once again I would underline *belief* and *personal
characteristics*.
> >
> > In short, when I bought AB I knew why I was buying it.
> > At that stage I had already settled on *trading* as my chosen
> > primary investment vehicle and I also had a definite trading
style.
> > I wanted to use AB as the tool to develop and implement that on a
> > wider scale.
> > I am continually improving and growing so I never say never as far
> > as trading goes but so far nothing I have learnt in AmiWorld has
> > changed my view on trading; it has simply confirmed and enhanced
it.
> >
> > I didn't know exactly what I was getting with AB but I did
exchange
> > a couple of emails with support in which I discussed the
capability
> > of AB in the key areas of my interest.
> > My questions were somewhat naive, and Tomasz probably scratched
his
> > head a little, but he gave me a professional reply.
> > Specifically I enquired about customising my own stops and one or
> > two other similar questions, as I do not trade in anything I don't
> > understand.
> > If I can code it myself I definitely understand it.
> >
> > I had also found that what passes as folklore in common investment
> > culture more often than not does not stand up to analysis, so I
> > prefer to go my own way; no *canned* anything for me.
> >
> > My conclusion was that on the balance of probability AB would do
the
> > job. I also formed a favourable impression of the CEO/developer
i.e.
> > he was obviously no dummy with an exceptional empathy for his
users
> > and that is an important thing when buying and using trading
> > software.
> > You have to have confidence.
> > (That wasn't too bad an assessment based on two short emails was
it?
> > Time has proven that to be spot on).
> >
> > Like all products, only long term ownership will provide a
complete
> > answer to buyer satisfaction, so I went ahead and purchased.
> > I am quite used to spending money on dead leads etc; that is
normal
> > business practise and I consider it to be a part of development
> > costs.
> > I didn't hesitate to spend USD$199 on Ami.
> > Like any business, there was no guarentee that cost would ever be
> > recouped. That is not to mention the intellectual capital invested
> > e.g. my first 2 trading years and $15000 were purely speculative
> > ventures, until I reached a point where I was able to prove to
> > myself that, compared to the majority, I was quite good at it.
> >
> > For the record my trading disposition is objective, mechanical
> > system, TA based, but I do keep an open mind and will snap up
> > anything that works.
> > I consider myself to be a developing trader.
> > It is not something that can be mastered in a few hundred or even
a
> > few thousand hours; not from my background anyway.
> >
> >
> > I could write a book on the subject, and I might one day, but to
cut
> > to the chase.
> >
> > I have used a lot of other market programs but my experience is
> > lightweight compared to some in this group.
> > I will benchmark my comments against the last program I used,
which
> > was one of the majors.
> > I was very happy with it in every respect until after 1000's of
> > hours of commitment to learning it, I found it couldn't actually
do
> > what I really needed it to.
> > The backtester didn't work, at least not the way I expected it
too,
> > and at that time my expectations were not as high as they are now.
> >
> > I managed to jig around that problem by using the programs
explorer
> > as a psuedo-backtester and exporting the results to Xcel for
> > analysis.
> > I was proud of myself, as a non-programmer, for achieving that.
> > I set up four older computers with a KVM switch as my test-bank
and
> > reeled off a few thousand hours of backtesting until I simply came
> > to the end of the line, fullstop.
> > Why stuff around with homemade backtesters when there are
> > professionals writing and maintaining them for a living?
> >
> > Hence AmiBroker, which incidentally was recommended to me by the
> > developer of a quite well known money management program.
> >
> > It was very hard to have to start all over again in a new program,
> > especially after being able to use the old one fluently.
> > The first 3 months of Ami were very de-motivating.
> > I found it to be a hard program to learn and I had to grit my
teeth
> > more than a few times.
> > One of the reasons it is hard to learn is that it has a lot more
> > depth and breadth than my previous program.
> > That automatically demands more learning time.
> > It also has a different business model to what most of us have
come
> > to expect e.g the manual in AB is not a textbook that is posted in
> > the mail nor is it merely the help files.
> > The *manual* in Ami is dynamic and offers a lot more than help
files
> > but it is also less structured.
> > It also leaves out a few bits and pieces here and there that a lot
> > of beginners would expect to find.
> > I am comfortable with that but some people aren't.
> > It is not a good system for beginners but it is a great system for
> > seasoned performers.
> > Why begrudge them that; they are entitled to their place in the
> > world?
> > I guess in a way, that makes Ami a boutique program, although I am
> > sure Tomasz will correct me if that is wrong.
> > My attitude is; "if you can't beat them join them".
> > I am playing catch-up at a furious rate.
> >
> >
> > My trading objectives are very high.
> > I bought AB in the belief that it was the program most likely to
> > enable me to meet those objectives.
> > I have had the program approx 6 months and have spent a lot of
hours
> > per week on it.
> > I don't have the definitive answer but so far AB has not
> > disappointed.
> > The ultimate responsibility is not on Tomasz's shoulders, it is on
> > mine.
> > Initially Tomasz answered my *buying* questions and provided a
free
> > trial.
> > It was my decision to buy.
> > Let the buyer beware.
> >
> >
> > I am continually learning and improving so the things I want to do
> > in the future may well be different from my current expectations
but
> > I am confident Ami will accommodate my growth.
> > I have said that if I don't achieve my trading goals with Ami
there
> > will not be another program, which is my way of saying that Ami is
> > good enough if I am good enough.
> > I do have a cut off point and I will retire my trading career if I
> > retire Ami.
> >
> > I won't look back and list the negatives of other programs.
> > I will not list the negatives of AmiBroker either (I am into
> > positivity) although I will say it is not perfect.
> >
> > ******************************************************************
> >
> > My list of AB positives (not in any particular order):
> >
> > 1. price
> > 2. *fully* customiseable
> > 3. distant horizon (most traders will never exceed its ability.
> > Those who do exceed AB's limits don't mind sharing their
> > knowledge and Tomasz doesn't like coming second so that should
tell
> > you something).
> > 4. transparent and controllable
> > 5. honest dialogue
> > 6. ethical company
> > 7. allows use with a wide range of data providers
> > 8. cheap and free data options for those who need that
> > 9. trading orientated program (truly for traders by traders)
> > 10. trading friendships
> > 11. trading mentorships
> > 12. active forum with a sprinkling of diverse specialists
> > 13. quick responses to program 'bugs'
> > 14. 24-48 hour support
> > 15. rapid pace of development
> > 16. responsive to suggestions
> > 17. extensive support material albeit hard to find at first
> > 18. open architecture
> > 19. personal contact with CEO
> > 20. CEO accepts and answers criticism in public
> > 21. trading specific programming language (you don't need to learn
> > C++ etc just learn AFL. If that is your first language it will be
a
> > challenge but I am doing it. I only read half a dummies book,
> > quarter of an online manual on scripting and a bit of Wikipedia
here
> > and there and away I went. My prior formula language and
backtesting
> > experience does help though).
> > 22. the last market software program I will ever have to master
> > 23. challenging
> > 24. offers trading opportunities I hadn't thought of before
> > 25. good rapport with and respect for the developer
> > 26. provides easy access to basic fundamental data in formulas
> > 27. provides access to unlimited external database (especially
> > useful for referencing extensive fundamental databases)
> > 28. cheap and reliable *industry standard* charting program for
> > those who just want that
> > 29. time efficient (there are no unneccessary frills anywhere in
> > Amiworld. If anything there are probably not enough frills
depending
> > on who you ask).
> > 30. mature program (10+ years)
> > 31. extensive library (official and unofficial) of popular
industry
> > indicators etc
> > 32. licenced to use on more than one machine
> > 33. speed
> > 34. 64 bit and dual core processors not a future problem?
> > 35. backward compatibility not a problem?
> > 36. has trading orientated functions the others do not have?
> > 37. array based processing which is a very *commonsense* approach
> > for laypeople. Use is analagous to Xcel spreadsheet rows except
for
> > more advanced uses where programming procedures like looping come
> > into play (when you can see your code output being written into
Xcel
> > rows in your minds eye you are nearly there).
> > I have spent a lot of time in Xcel prior to AB so that helps me to
> > step into AFL. If you are good with Xcel functions you will
> > definitely be good with AFL.
> > 38. industry standard *canned scans* are easily achievable with
> > simple code
> > 39. It is a very pragmatic program e.g I have 5-10 tasks on my
> > advanced list that are industry wide trader breakers. I have
already
> > cracked two or three of those in Ami without even getting out of
> > second gear and I am optimistic about the rest (Null data
handling,
> > custom indexes and survivor bias are the first three demons to
bite
> > the dust).
> > 40. readily perform trainging examples and problem solve using
> > explorer.
> > 41. ASCII import for the data masochists
> >
> > In short it does exactly what the publicity blurb on the homepage
> > says it will do, and more!
> >
> >
> > There are probably additional postives but a mint tea and a bowl
of
> > muesli is calling.
> >
> > BrianB2. =8-)
> >
> > P.S Tomasz, this doesn't provide you future immunity from my
> > withering critiques.
> >
> > --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "jlami11" <jlami11@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I just wanted to know how Amibroker compares to other software.
> > >
> > > In particular I heard tradingblox was pretty good and could do
> > alot,
> > > while requiring less programming. Or would programming required
be
> > the
> > > same if more advanced functions were needed e.g. dynamic pos
> > sizing,
> > > dynamic risk control etc etc.
> > >
> > > Has anyone used tradingblox? and if Amibroker and Tradingblox
were
> > the
> > > same price, which one would you prefer?
> > >
> > > Lastly is Amibroker generally superior to other software? I ask
> > this
> > > as I come from a non-programming background and would not be
easy
> > for
> > > me to adapt to diff. software in future.
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance any help is appreciated.
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Please note that this group is for discussion between users only.
> >
> > To get support from AmiBroker please send an e-mail directly to
> > SUPPORT {at} amibroker.com
> >
> > For other support material please check also:
> > http://www.amibroker.com/support.html
> >
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Rajeev Mundra | Founder : EagleEye TradeTech
> Cell: +91 98608 51052 | Yahoo Id: rajeevmundra
> Email: rajeevmundra@xxx
> ~Take Risks www.eetradeconsult.blogspot.com
>
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