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John, you are largely arguing the semantics of laguage here, rather then
information. My clarified replies are highlighted by the two sandwiched
=======
My guess is your firm still uses TOPS to execute minis, and hence your
bias???
I have a question at the end. If you would please provide your input there.
> I repliy: ***** You are mixing apples and oranges here. Globex2 is a
trading
> engine. FIX API is a pipe/language standard to route to the trading
engine.
> TOPS is a routing system which connects to a different pipe/language
standard
> (TOPS Globex2 Gateway) to get to Globex2. TOPS has a lot to do with
> electronic trading. It is a means for many traders to access electronic
> and/or open outcry markets. It is the pre-eminent way that Retail orders
are
> routed to Globex2 AND open outcry markets.
==========================================================================
Not mixing at all that I see. The CME FIX API has been designed to allow
firms and Independent Software Vendors to integrate their order entry and
routing systems with the CME. FIX API functionality is designed to route
orders from external order routing systems through the CME's central Order
Managers (OMs) to GLOBEX2, CUBS2 and/or TOPS. TOPS is NOT an electronic
gateway. That is a small part of it AND one the CME is encouraging users to
not use for e-trading. TOPS is NOT an e trading platform, and is tangentally
involved in the sense your telephone used to be for trading.
======================================================================
>
>
> TOPS is the Trading Order Processing System owned jointly by the CME and
> CBOT. It is a routing system for orders to all exchanges, of which the
large
> majority are open outcry. The order is called to the broker who then
enters
> it into the TOPS system and it is routed and fills are routed back
> automatically.
> **** Your description is not completely accurate. There are many Internet
> trading platforms which route to TOPS. TOPS connects to trading floor
> printers, CUBS2 units at the CME and Electronic Clerk terminals at the
CBOT.
> A trader need not ever talk to a broker when placing an order or
retrieving a
> fill, depending on the system being used and its performance.
===================================================
Okay, I could have said "sent" instead of called, as a phone is not
necessary. Other then that its exactly accurate.
==================================================
>
> It has in the past been able to connect to the FIX API for e-trading in
the
> nas mini and sp e-mini.
>
> ****** TOPS has never been connected to the FIX API for emini trading.
There
> is a Gateway from TOPS to Globex2 that was developed to facilitate emini
> trading. TOPS handles a lot of volume that it need not necessarily handle
> given some of the alternatives now available. The FIX API was introduced
> partly to alleviate some of this volume. The FIX API is supposed to be
the
> connection from trading platforms to connect to three different routes:
==========================================================
The CME FIX API provides access to both GLOBEX2 and exchange floor
operations through TOPS and CUBS2. The CME FIX API will replace the Order
Routing API (ORAPI) and has been designed to overcome the current
limitations of the ORAPI interface as well as REPLACE the TOPS process for
all order flow directed to the GLOBEX2 electronic trading system and the
CUBS2 electronic broker desk management system.
=========================================================
> Globex2, CUBS2 and TOPS. Right now however, the FIX API is really only
being
> used for connecting trading platforms to Globex2. No volume is being
routed
> to CUBS2 or TOPS from the FIX API. There are a couple of firms which have
> done some testing connecting it to TOPS, but they don't use it. No one,
to
> my knowledge is even testing the CUBS2 connection.
>
>
> However any firm not far behind the technology curve, has already switched
> away from TOPS for access to the FIX API. In terms of e-trading, if a firm
is
> still using ORAPI (Order Routing API ) instead of FIX API they are behind
the
> technology curve.
>
> ***** This really depends on whether you are trading open outcry or
> electronic markets and is a bit judgmental and biased towards the CME.
How
> about Eurex? Or LIFFE? How about the a/c/e? You can't access those
markets
> from the FIX API. And you can't access any U.S. open outcry markets from
the
> FIX. What you have is a mishmash of systems and interfaces and it really
> depends on the markets someone wants to trade, their trading approach and
the
> things they value (speed or dependability). The FIX API is certainly
faster
> for eminis than TOPS. However, one firm who is connected to the FIX API
> and does the most FIX API volume) has all their open outcry orders print
at
> their order desk and they call them down to the floor. So, they are up to
> date with their electronically matched orders and 5 years behind with the
> open orders. I would agree the FIX API is the future, but it does not
offer
> the same degree of order management and support as does TOPS. This is a
> value that many different firms have maintained despite the attractive
speed
> of the FIX API. There are larger issues that which is the fastest pipe.
> There are issues like what is the best system to manage risk for the firm.
> TOPS is known, dependable and offers tremendous order management that FIX
API
> does not. If a trader using LEO needs to change an order and LEO is down,
> there are dozens of TOPS operators who can change or cancel that order.
The
> same trader, calling a firm accessing the markets via the FIX API and that
> system is down, must change the order via a limited number of Globex2
> machines, or they could cancel an order via Firmsoft on a limited number
of
> machines connected to the CME's networkd for that product.
===========================================================
This discussion was SOLELY about stock index mini trading. And for mini
trading TOPS is not the best choice.
===========================================================
>
> The FIX API is exclusive to the CME and is specific to e-trading.
>
> ***** The FIX API is an industry standard API and used widely across the
> securities industry for back office systems. The CME had used a slightly
> different version to facilitate futures, but is shifting to a brand new
> version which has futures compatibility built in.
>
>
> It is an interface that allows brokerage firms or independant software
> companies like PATS to access the CME electronic OM's (Order Managers).
The
> OM's hold all MIT and STOP orders until they are triggered. Unlike open
> outcry markets they must be triggered by an actual trade, not just a bid
or
> ask price.
>
> ***** Stops are handled different by different ISV's (Independent Software
> Vendors). PATS currently holds stops on the user's machine and they are
> elected once a trade from the price feed received shows at the price. I
> don't know how MIT orders are handled. And it is important to not confuse
> the exchange servers of an ISV with the Order Manager Server of the CME.
>
>
> Orders sent through TOPS are stored on the TOPS OM, NOT the FIX API
> OM. Where it gets tricky, and where you really need someone from the CME
> to tell you, and I am not sure they would, is that each firm has one or
more
> servers that store that firms order book for globex2. They all connect to
the
> actual trade execution platform. Where the tricky part is, is how each
> server's
> orders are executed as they are sent to the execution platform. Is one
> server faster? Does checking the orders against prices to see if the stop
is
> executed take enough time that new market orders jump ahead of it? I
> am not sure.
>
>
> ***** I am confused by your statements above. There is one Order Manager
> Server or System from the CME. There are also servers at the FCM to
access
> the OM Servers or directly to Globex2 depending on how orders are being
> routed, TOPS, FIX API, etc. Orders are not held by the firms servers, but
> routed through them. All orders electronic orders, regardless if they
were
> sent to the CME through TOPS or the FIX API are databased in a product
called
> Firmsoft.
>
=======================================
Maybe I am confused. I understood there were many OM's that "held" the STOP
and MIT orders and then sent them for execution as elected.
Your saying this is not true?
=======================================
> ***** I agree this is confusing. Even some very bright people at the CME
get
> confused when trying to explain it, as it is very complicated.
>
> Regards,
>
> John J. Lothian
>
> Disclcosure: Futures trading involves financial risk, lots of it! John J.
> Lothian is the President of the Electronic Trading Division of The Price
> Futures Group, Inc., an Introducing Broker.
>
> And to be honest, I think its a red herring. Save a disaster of technology
> malfunction, e-trading is nirvana compared to the pits. I use it
extensively
> everyday, and have never had a bad fill.
>
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>
>
>
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