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</x-html>From ???@??? Mon Jun 26 06:53:19 2000
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From: "Gram" <gramario@xxxxxx>
To: <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [RT] R: R: R: Re: R: Re: R: R: Re: Stocks and futures
Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 13:08:02 +0200
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<P align=justify>To those who deliberately misinterpet my comments, I state that
language exists (amongst other things) for communication and transference of
knowledge - it is in YOUR interests to understand. How can Christine accuse me
of "by boasting of your situation and wagging your finger at everyone for
not letting the tax tail wag the dog.... "</P>
<P>when I was asking questions like the following:</P>
<P align=justify>"What country do you live in? Don't they have a tax
system? This is not a joke,<BR>just interested"</P>
<P align=justify>TradeWell,<BR>Joe Frabosilio </P>
<P align=justify>"I guess the next logical question is: Where (what country
& state/province)<BR>have you found that is so resident/income friendly that
no taxes are<BR>required?" </P>
<P align=justify>"So, where are you pray tell? "</P>
<P align=justify>Eliot </P>
<P>"Where do you live?"<BR>Norman E. </P>
<P>" </P>
<P align=justify>How are you supposed to pay no taxes...are you talking about
deferred pension, IRA, etc... </P>
<P>Just wondering," </P>
<P>Steven <BR></P>
<P>Christine also wrote: </P>
<P align=justify>"I suspect that you know that a large number on this list
are in north <BR>america where we have it pretty good. In very few cases would
people want <BR>to renounce their citizenship in order to save some money. Even
with bubba <BR>at the helm!! :)" </P>
<P align=justify></P>
<P align=justify>Did I intimate that anyone else should renounce their
citizenship or similar? If so, it certainly was not my intention. I merely
pointed out that there are certain costs in trading which sholud be put on the
scales, along with commisions, telephone bills, computers, programs, slippage,
etc. </P>
<P align=justify></P>
<P align=justify> </P>
<P align=justify>This morning, I verified the comments objections made by the
Doctor as to my situation and mode of operating, and have found them to without
foundation; as one broker/international tax expert called them: "Mere
heresay and rubbish". It is true that you have to tick the W-8 form, but
you do not (at least, we do not) "get a slew of forms to back up the issue
of tax avoidance."</P>
<P align=justify>He also pointed out that if brokers/clients had to pay 30%+ on
each transaction, they would no longer trade the US markets. </P>
<P align=justify>It is also omnious that none of our European list-members have
stated whether they pay such withholdings on their trades! </P>
<P align=justify></P>
<P align=justify>In any event, I have decided to unsubscribe from R - to remove,
as it were, the thorn in the side of the righteous. I have no desire to be
slighted and insulted publicly by a man who, in the light of my findings (see
above paragraph) has given erroneous information to this list and by so doing
has blocked its path to the truth. Some might see him as The Overseer, and no
doubt he is a competent advisor as far as trading is concerned. However, if he
insists on giving unfounded, inexact advice, then perhaps he should think of
changing his nom de guerre from Doctor to something less presumptious, or at
least temper his arrogance with a little more openmindedness.</P>
<P align=justify></P>
<P align=justify>Thank you to those who have contributed to the list during my
stay - I found most of the exchanges refreshing, interesting, and educative.</P>
<P align=justify></P>
<P align=justify>I wish you all good trading and a healthy (stressless)
existence.</P>
<P align=justify></P>
<P align=justify>Gram.</P></FONT><FONT size=2>
<P align=justify></P></FONT><FONT size=4>
<P>p.s. Norman wrote: "...we have 80 golf courses". I am still trying
to figure out why he needs 80 golf courses. In any event, can't top that. We do
have a castle, recently built by the Barclay twins on Brechou, a small island
which form of Sark. It cost about $100 million or so, and is staffed by about 40
people. But I suppose NW-land has 80 of these,
too.</P></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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From: "Gram" <gramario@xxxxxx>
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Subject: [RT] R: unsubscribe
Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 13:10:52 +0200
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</x-html>From ???@??? Mon Jun 26 06:53:25 2000
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Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 07:38:44 -0400
From: Daniel Goncharoff <TheGonch@xxxxxxxxxx>
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Subject: [RT] Re: R: R: R: Re: R: Re: R: R: Re: Stocks and futures
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Gram
I hope you will reconsider staying on RT. The number of questions about
your situation, and the ignorance of those considered knowledgeable in
trading about the environment faced by those living and trading outside
the US, simply demonstrates the need for voices with varying experiences
and situations, yours included.
As for The Doctor, my own experience tells me that even if he had done
the 'right thing', eg, asked a compliance officer in the US about exempt
status, he would have gotten a definitive answer that a US tax ID is
necessary. If he had asked a compliance officer at the London office of
a US firm, however, he probably would have gotten the correct answer.
About 40% of my career with investment banks was out of the US, and I
saw this parochialism (an attitude that what goes in the US MUST go for
everybody, everywhere) all the time.
Anyways, I hope you'll stay.
Regards
DanG
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