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In response to Conrad's final question (about visiting newbie sights and
being suprised as to the amount of broker errors that he sees there).
I am a new trader in relation to the years of experience that are on this
list. When starting out I too relized that alot of people seemed to complain
about bad fills, orders being forgotten, cancel replace orders not going
through and leaving one in the market for days without the trader knowing
it, etc. I searched for a broker that would never make a mistake. Seeing
these "horror" stories made me want to take every precaution to make sure
that I did not have the same experience. But how could I be so sure? I was
in a state of paranoia.
During this time I was reading some trading book (sorry that I cannot
remember which) and the point came out that when people lose they always
want someone to blame. No one likes to admit that market losses are their
own fault. How many people have called there account representative and
said "I thought that I had taken off that S&P position on the close
yesterday and it just opened in my favor 8 points, I want out of that trade
at yesterdays close, and take $2000 out of my account." Not very many, but
I bet the situation has occured.
IMO, if every trader would accept his own mistakes as quickly as brokers
admit there's they would trade better.
just my 2 cents, good trading
rob
p.s. I know that there are legitamet (sp?) mistakes every now and then, put
it down as a cost of doing business and keep trading. It is still the best
job in the world.
any other comments, or responses?
-----Original Message-----
From: cb <cpbow@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: RealTraders Discussion Group <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Monday, December 14, 1998 3:43 PM
Subject: Re: DISCOUNT BROKERS
>Bogeybunky@xxxxxxx wrote:
>>
>> I never see any comments on this forum from traders who are using some of
the
>> more heavily advertised discount commodity brokers such as: Jack Carl,
Lind
>> Waldock, Ira Epstein, First American, et al.
>>
>> I would be interested in hearing any experiences (good or bad) with any
of
>> these type brokers.
>
>This is a response to both the above question and John Lothian's post.
>I tend to agree with him that it may be worth a small premium to trade
>with an experienced broker rather than a discount firm, (unless you can
>get *really* low rates). I cannot compare with a deep-discounter since
>I have only traded thru two accounts (one of which was a short-lived
>stay with a fs broker). Altho I am not actually not answering about the
>discount service, perhaps it will be useful to you or others. If not, I
>apologize.
>
>I am a customer of Jack Carl's "one-on-one" service. Actually you are
>assigned to a pair of brokers who are actual experienced brokers, not
>clerks. I have had the same pair for the past 3 years. I believe I was
>told that their combined exp. at the time I signed up was 10 years.
>Their accuracy has been excellent. There have been only 2 desk errors
>and 1 floor error in about 300 ? trades. With one error, the broker
>remembered the order and offerred to make it good. One, he immediately
>offerred to review the tape. On the floor error I wrote a letter which
>they forwarded to the exchange who investigated and then wrote back,
>saying there was no wrong=doing due to a fast market.
>
>With very few exceptions the fills have been quite good. I can't really
>comment on speed, since I am a position trader, sometimes not even at
>the phone they call on.
>
>Their initial rate for this service is $43/RT compared to $25 (?) for
>their discount service which I believe goes thru clerks. However, after
>you are with them for a while you can negotiate a lower rate.
>
>The level of individual service is not such that they are going to catch
>every error. If you are in Jul. wheat and want to get out, and say sell
>1 Mar. wheat they may not catch it. That being said, they know me by
>name and (even know my acct. #) and style of trading. They also will do
>a few things a discount service will not, such as OCO orders where not
>taken on exchange, mkt. price "alerts". However, they won't do the wide
>range of orders that a full service broker might take (like if
>jellybeans go up to 100, sell a Mar. jb option at 20 ob).
>
>I consider working with these 2 individuals worth the small additional
>amount I pay above the discount rate. What I'm not sure is, especially
>since my small account size requires me to take small positions (usually
>Midam or options) is whether I should seek one of the really discounted
>commissions like $20 (online?), but I'm not at all sure I could get that
>with the v. small account I currently have.
>
>There is something i am curious about. I frequent a number of the sites
>which have a fair number of beginners on them as well as experienced. I
>am often surprised by some of the errors described there. Are these
>actually errors due to these relatively new clients? Or is the typical
>error rate, even among full service brokers, higher than what I have
>experienced?
>
>[no rel. to JC ex. as a customer]
>
>Conrad Bowers
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