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Ladies and Gentle Men - I've laid out most of my claims against Genesis/Larson and
Larson has stated his. I'll answer the questions that have been raised, then I'll
retreat so the discussion can get back to regular trading. Some of the following
is copied from yesterday's emails. If more info is desired, please contact me
offline. Thanks.
--------------------------------------------
>Gary Larson of Genesis sent me this rebuttal to Beno's posting. It's only fair
to hear both sides. What concerns me here is the claim that Mr. Beno refused to
accept a mediated resolution. Why?
>
>- Mark Jurik
>
Hello, Mark - it IS fair to hear both sides. But - as I warned - Larson's message
is filled with inconsistencies, half-truths and out-of-context references. I've
been trying to get him to debate the issue openly for months. My position is that
a mediator is one, juries are twelve, and the Internet is thousands. I have
repeatedly proposed that he and I discuss this openly, on a Forum. The "jury"
would
be people like you, who know trading and data, yet are not directly involved and
would be impartial. I would abide by a simple majority opinion, whether it was by
5 respondents or 500. Larson has refused.
-------------------------------------
(from Joe) Hi Tom;
>
>I got the following off the RT list. I was interested in their assertion
>that you never updated data from them, or that you never paid them anything?
>
Hello, Joe - I downloaded from Genesis EVERY DAY during late April thru May 9,
1997. It was another "try us and see" offer, like he put out again yesterday in
his "rebuttal." OK - I tried it, and found the service absolutely terrible. Here's
what I "tried and saw," and what I emailed to Larson:
"I've sent Genesis 3 emails (4/10, 4/16 and 4/23) and 3 FAXes (4/18, 4/23 and
4/24). Five of those six requests are still unanswered. On 4/17 a polite gentleman
(Mark in sales) sent me an (incomplete) instruction sheet on how to upgrade. Since
then I've called their tech support group EIGHTEEN MORE TIMES..."
(So, Joe - I did NOT pay them for this "service." Would you? Of course, Larson
didn't mention that part, did he? Refer back to "half-truths" and "hip waders...")
------------------------------------------
>+++++ So who offers reliably clean data? +++++++
>
>(from Van) "I knew Genesis Data was Good."
>
>>(from Neal) I'd agree. I get Genesis end-of-day files every day, and I'm
>>satisfied.
>>No data vendor is perfect, all have some bad data.
>>
Gentlemen - some data errors are almost a "given." I didn't ask for (nor expect)
perfection.
I did (and do) expect a decent product, honesty, and the gumption to suck it up
and make it right if something goes wrong. I also believe that a few ethics, a
little honor and some responsibility should be expected.
The Bad Data is actually a secondary issue to those items of personal and
professional integrity.
As for Delta - I've been a member since 1993. I advised them of the Genesis scam
twice (5/27 and 6/4/98). Unfortunately, they responded to neither of those
messages. I've now asked to be put in direct touch by phone with Welles Wilder.
The note that was put out on the Internet in Welles' name was written by (I
believe) his nephew. Welles' name was referenced, but David's name clearly shows
as the author on the "original" email I got, but was strangely omitted on that
which Larson posted on the Internet. Again - "bring your hip waders."
So - I've had my say, Larson had his, and you've voiced yours. Here are a few
other opinions I've received, some privately, some from other forums. I have more,
but I think the message is clear.
========================
>Tom;
>Very interesting message. I had fairly extensive problems with Genesis when I
first signed on with them; not so much over bad data as no data. The software
they sent me wouldn't work at all...three sets in succession...In any case, thanks
for the heads up and I'll be a bit more watchful.
>Best regards,
>------------------------------------------
>Tom,
> Kudos to you for your tenacity in exposing this fool. The job of trading is
difficult enough without faulty products.
------------------------------------------
>Tom:
>
>I wanted to drop a note to you about the Genesis campaign that you are waging.
It seems that Larson is content to knowingly offer a flawed product - without any
regard for the impact this could potentially have on the traders out there relying
on this information. While the trading business is basically honest, I guess there
are always going to be a few hustlers out there playing games.
>
>Congratulations for hanging in there and trying to expose a corrupt vendor in the
market!
>--------------------------------------
Everything Tom wrote about Genesis is true, they are the worst. Their problem is
not an occasional problem, it is negligence form their data to their program
leaving files open on your computer on download.
Continue on Tom!!
j.
------------------------------------
>Most people take whatever crap a vendor will dish out and I'm glad you didn't.
>
>A.
---------------------------------
Tom:
...I have had similar problems with Genesis. I sent lists of data problems to them
many times and they either ignored them or took their sweet time about fixing
them. It appears that Genesis expects their clients to correct the data and this
is no joke, they really do.
--------------------------------
Hi Tom,
One thing that I expect from the companies I support is good customer service
performed in a timely manner. I feel that you did not receive either one. This
is a far greater problem in my mind then the bad data problem. I have had
multiple data vendors in the past and I have experienced bad data in all of them.
However, all of the vendors in the past have agreed to fix it. That is the
difference between the other vendors and Genesis.
=========================
Gentlemen - to those of you who have offered support and testimony, I thank you
again. To you, to Glen Larson, to all traders and to everyone else vulnerable to a
scam, I stand by my original commentary about Genesis/Larson. Thank you for your
time.
Tom Beno
Maple Valley, WA
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