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<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>Peter I see an interseting historical corollary,
which makes perfect sense in the Elliott count we both share. wrt
DJIA</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2>First a summary</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2> Going back to the year 1765,
when the Elliott picture/count began , wave 1
ended in the year 1835, wave A of 2 then ended in 1860 & was a flat,
clearly. followed by X in 1929, a double zigzag. then in 1949 a 21 year triangle
ended wave 2. This, as you well know & have pointed out is the basic
structure of the 1,2 ...1,2 ..... subdivisions.
But notice that in the next lower degree the 1974 correction started out as a
flat but became more complex.ie abc-x-abc. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2> The next subsivsion of one
lower degree which began in 1995 had its wave a of 2 correction also as a simple
flat , exaclty like 1835-1860 flat.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2> Currntly we are at the next
lower degree, in which it seems that the wave a of 2 correction is turning out
to be an abc correction it highly resembles the 1974 correction. But notice that
the correction from April to mid june is exactly the 1974 correction ie
abc-x-abc. The rise since then seems to be wave b, with wave c down, I think
that it will eventually come out to look like the 1974 correction in
minature. It seems to me that the wave a of 2 correction of each
alternate degree resembles one another in terms of construction yet seems
to be getting more complex where as the other alternate wave a of 2
[simple flats] seem to be getting simpler.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2> <FONT
color=#000000>THIS type of relationship implies that the rise from 1765 is not
of the same degree as Prechters "LOOSE FORM OF ELLIOTT" implies &
hence that we are headed for a crash, but rather it implies that large market
gain await us as no large degree is completed.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2><FONT
color=#000000></FONT> In this cuurent
correction we would expect wave B to be projected upward due to the power
of the overall elliott count, so the current correctio I think will be
like 1974 but slanted upwards.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000 size=2> I
PREDICT THE DOW TO REACH 100,000 BY 2050</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000
size=2>
Regards Peter</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000
size=2>
Krueger Klage Derivatives</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#000000
size=2>
Sydney Australia</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV></BODY></HTML>
</x-html>From ???@??? Sun Jul 26 20:05:12 1998
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Date: Sun, 26 Jul 1998 21:53:29 -0500 (CDT)
Reply-To: mundi1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sender: owner-realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: mundi1@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To: RealTraders Discussion Group <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Degree in trading (Alternative)
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On 07/17/98 22:57:07 you wrote:
>
>The only help I had getting started was someone showing me how to fill out the
>application for purchasing a seat.
>
>Many of the successful folks did in fact apprentice for some of the more famous
>traders. Jon Najarian(First Chapter of "Supertraders)apprenticed on the CBOE
>floor for another very successful trader. As an apprentice he was paid "0".
>The current salary for folks who clerk for independents at CBOE is "0". In
>essence you pay to earn. In essence that is my point. The way to learn is to
>learn. Lots of firm will train qualified folks to trade for them. In exchange
>for which they will want to own your "soul" for the next 2 or 3 years.
>
>You want to give up a couple years of income, a pretty hefty price, then you
>might get a shot. There isn't a day that goes by that a resume doesn't shop at
>CBOE from someone currently very successful....looking to give it up all up to
>learn how to trade.
>
>I know NOBODY REALLY GOOD who gives it away.......everybody pays a pretty high
>price. There ain't no easy cheap way to do it.
>
>BrentinUtahsDixie wrote:
>
>> Doc,
>>
>> Did anyone like this ever voluntarily help you when you were starting? Most
>> of the traders interviewed in Market Wizards were helped by someone at one
>> time or another. Just curious.
>>
>> Brent
>>
>> ----------
>> > From: THE DOCTOR <droex@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> > To: RealTraders Discussion Group <realtraders@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> > Subject: Re: Degree in trading (Alternative)
>> > Date: Friday, July 17, 1998 7:43 PM
>> >
>> > I know a good number of highly successful traders and I fail to see a
>> compelling
>> > reason why anyone would assume they would be willing to share the wisdom
>> they
>> > have acquired over the years. At the same time most of the folks who
>> sell
>> > trading expertise couldn't trade their way out of a one lot oex option
>> the day
>> > before expiration.
>> >
>> > Some thought IIT(Illlinois Institute of Technology)runs a college
>> > program..endowed by much of the trading community to train traders. It
>> was
>> > essentially established by the Chicago trading community to develop
>> "talent" on
>> > an mid to entry level of trading skill.
>> >
>> > Tony Saliba..profiled in Market Wizards does in fact run a school for
>> > professional option traders. It is used extensively by the professional
>> > community both in the US and Internationally. The only hang-up is it
>> cost a
>> > bundle ($10,000 + the last time I saw a price list). Most of the major
>> > proprietary trading firms do in fact runs in house schools, but they are
>> just
>> > that. They are designed for their future floor staffs.
>> >
>> > I'm kind of dismayed by the assumption that anyone would expect any of
>> these
>> > successful traders to really give it away.
>> >
>> > If I had developed a really valuable methodology for trade I would trade
>> it...
>> > not sell if. And that is exactly what they do.
>> >
>> > Glenn Pederson wrote:
>> >
>> > > On 16 Jul 98 at 13:37, BrentinUtahsDixie wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > 1 hour honest trading guidance from a magnanimous highly successful
>> former
>> > > > trader
>> > >
>> > > Anyone know how to find these highly successful traders willing to
>> > > give you an hour of their time? I have been in this business for
>> > > many years and have yet to come across any successful traders.
>> > >
>> > > Thanks,
>> > >
>> > > Glenn
>> > > gpeder@xxxxxxxxx
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
>
>
>
>
Doc, in response to "Supertraders". Something I have noticed, people such as Dr. J. (Jon Najarian) have no trading secrets
or any mystical holy grail. I know Jon quite well, as well as traded for Brian Gelber and Tom Baldwin, and they are all
normal people. What we do is run a business, and try to grow it. Dr. J's company, Mercury trading, is basically a
marketing and trading firm. Dr. J. is an extremely good floor trader, but more importantly, a good person, fantastic
businessman, and a great judge of character. You may be amazed, but I don't have, nor do most traders, a hard luck, rags to
riches story. We just work our way up. We master our trade, learn to incorparate solid trading theoretics and
fundemantals, and trade in a way that fits our personalities and styles. But the base is the same. Know yourself and your
trade, work hard, and it will pay off. These "supertraders" are still real people, and using Dr. J. for example, a few weeks
back, we went to a wedding of a trader friend of mine, sat at the same table with Jon, shared a few jokes, spoke of no work,
talked with his wife about there child thats coming, and new car, how weird it is to be on TV, ate dinner, bitched about the
dressing, smoked a Cigar, did a few shots, and everyone went home. Just like anyone else. He didn't glow or float, and if
you gave him a call, I would trade on a 90 delta, that if he was in and had time, would spend some time with you on the
phone or invite you down to speak with him. And if floor trading is the game you want to play, call any trading house,
become a clerk, work long hours, do your homework, and work your way to being a trader. It really (trading) is quite simple
once you understand the basic theory (reversa/conversions), everything else, including making money becomes an art form. I
truly belive that and that is what has worked for me as well as others. My advice is...don't look for someone to give you
the answers...including a college course at ITT, it is good for nothing more than basic theory that you can pick up in
Natenburgs book. And I myself always try to help others out...so if i can, feel free to ask. I hope I can help. David
Gennrich, MUNDI
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