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Pierre.
I was expecting your very objective comments earlier and find my
subjective comments below yours.....
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : VK [mailto:vk@xxxxxxxxx]
> Envoyé : dimanche 17 novembre 2002 19:15
> À : tachyonv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; omega-list@xxxxxxxxxx
> Objet : AW: Replacement for 2000i
>
>
> People will use the software whose back testing capability is nearly
> unlimited and where they see the willingness to improve the software
all
> the time.
Volker,
Rather than claiming that you are here to help, your message is truely
a proof
of the usual underlying vampirism behaviour.
You are here to sell your software, usually by presenting it under a
fallacious
superiority over TradeStation, and or so called help.
I may inderstand that you want to help customers to quit TradeStation,
but this
is not the purpose of this list.
[VK>>]
I want nobody to quit TS, most people use both. But if I would start
into this business I want to be informed and if somebody is asking for
replacement it is the right for anyone who offers alternatives to speak
out. Just as you were quick to recommend TS6.
Let me say one thing: SERIOUSLY,if for any reason I was enforced to
move from
TradeStation to an other platform ( I speak here as an USER and SYSTEM
DEVELOPER), Wealth Lab would not be the choice.
I have carefully visited the WL site and it's a good amateur work, but
nothing
that compares with TS.
[VK>>]
You keep on talking about the web site. You did that month ago. When do
YOU understand that there is a software that one can install on the
desktop. I have some advantage over you, I used TS, MetaStock, Behold!,
Excalibur, BackTrak, ..... you have never used WLD2 which is ok but
gives you a disadvantage.
The langage is complicated, takes more lines to write the same in EL,
has
cumbersome declaration statement and unwanted loops only to generate buy
sell
signals.
[VK>>]
You are right the language is more complicated then EL at the moment.
But what do you say if we introduce drag and drop system development in
our next version?
Most of the functions are not disclosed. All of the TS functions are
and here
is also the power of true debugging.
[VK>>]
Talking about true debugging, this will be introduced too and with the
new version comes a new handbook that has many more functions disclosed.
The design of the langage is the key of the software and actually none
is
matching EL.
[VK>>]
That was the original purpose, to give a full programming language with
the ease of use fort he trading industry. Again drag and drop will be
coming soon.
Most of the time the language used is a simple plug of a general purpose
langage
like VB, Java, Delphi in your case.
I'm even not sure that it is a compiled language.
[VK>>]
This proves that you should do a bit more homework.
What the developers have not understood with EL is that a language has
been
designed from scratch and adapted to one specific application: time
series
analysis and trading system design. This is where the TS advantage is
as well
with the on demand native database.
[VK>>]
Most data vendors have that already. So with WLD2 you can on your
computer any time and get the data updated up to the minute. I remember
how much pain that was with TS2000i. SO it was a good move of TS to do
that, but with all respect I think all latest software has that.
Automated orders coming after that.
[VK>>]
And everyone else has it now too.
Easy langage is not a Pascal plug. It's a smart way to deal with maket
data
with a clever database access, designed to work with the software.
Should WL developer have thought about this before starting to code (
plug),
this would have been different.
[VK>>]
It seems that EL is you only argument for TS? So would you then say if a
software has a drag and drop programming possibility for simple system
creation (like TS has with EL) then WLD2 is a real competitor?
Weak choice at the begining, so you have to rewrite the language. Same
case for
Metastock, a good charting program, but a nightmare programming langage
ersatz
Lisp based that they carry like a punishment since the begining!
[VK>>]
See above, like to hear you comment then.
Adding so called features like portfolio optimisation to a weak platform
cannot
be seen as an advandage.
[VK>>]
Why do you say weak platform? It is not only portfolio optimisation but
also portfolio level backtesting with portfolio level money management
rules applicable on it.
If you really cannot see where the difference is in the language, you
are not
really qualified to speak like you do.
[VK>>]
Again the LANGUAGE. See above and is it the ONLY advantage of TS???
For those who read ads without asking questions, I urge you to read
their
technical support forum, then you will see where bell and whistles
really are.
[VK>>]
Thanks for inviting everybody over just imagine I would have done it.
Please point them also to the over 500 systems published by the
community as a base for discussion. I remember how difficult it is/was
to get sample codes or lets take the open of tomorrow or the open in 10
days (some people charge money for that).
Wealth lab is again a good amateur work that was facilitated by the
modern RAD
tools: Graphic libraries are now common and ready to plug, the general
language
is ready to plug, then just add 100 or less trading fuctions and you
have a so
called TS competitor ( that will lok like to the dumb user), badly
designed for
sure, but available to any individual developer ( case apply to Wealth
lab,
Esignal, Neo Ticker and the like).
[VK>>]
Of course!
Case DO NOT apply to Easy Language.
[VK>>]
Of course not :).
>
> As another consequence I think the business model of TS will start to
> vanish by end of next year. It is just a logical consequence, just
think
> about it: What would you do?
>
This is where we can see that you do not understand anything to the
problem,
where you only focus on some obvious TS limitations that you are not
able to
solve.
[VK>>]
At least you admit that there are some.
1. So please tell me which TS limitations are you talking about?
This answer is VERY important to me, coming from the horse mouth ( I
think that’s how they say it in English),
Producing a TS competitor is a false problem ( badly addressed in your
case).
Ease of use, stability and reputation is more important in such a small
market
niche.
[VK>>]
We are not a TS competitor, that would lift up TS into a league where
they are not ;).
Stability and reputation...... mmmmhhhhh, read:
Stability = don’t make improvements/changes
Reputation = marketing
Ease of use = TS still has a slight advantage here, we know and we are
working on it.
FYI, so called WL advantages are feasible with TS. For example, walk
forward
optimisation that I use since 1993. Portfolio optimisation is feasible
too,
using even some public domain tools, not to speak of the Rina things. So
excepted some nifty 3D graphics (also available with external tools),
[VK>>]
Like the once that one can buy from you? Thanks for giving me the
opportunity again in letting everyone know (and you said it yourself)
that ALL this is included in WL. So no more add ons, RINAs at least for
the obvious things.
I cannot
see where the advantage is, but I'm still able to see where the
numerous
glitches are and will remain because of the general design mistake that
probably
only TS avoided.
[VK>>]
I am getting bored that you talk about the programming language again.
TS has one advantage, that is that EL is widely excepted. If I would
start today learning to program I would go for WealthScript. Why,
because it is just as easy if you start out with it and it gives you
more power.
> To make a long story short:
> I would not buy TS stocks. :)
Let me recall that you cannot buy Wealth lab stocks too...
[VK>>]
Somebody tried...............
Well, there are no WL stocks, even OTC ?
[VK>>]
And soon there will be no more TS stocks. So what argument is that.
Would you turn the volume down now, it should be better.
[VK>>]
Not until we get this thing here settled. Please turn on your volume and
let us hear your answers.
Sincerely,
Volker Knapp
www.wealth-lab.com
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