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No,
you aren't able to actually short a mutual fund.
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size=2>
Yes,
"bear" funds are actually short only on the underlying
securities.
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<FONT face="Times New Roman"
size=2>-----Original Message-----From: jtelang
[mailto:jtelang@xxxxxxxxx]Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003 10:20
PMTo: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxSubject: [amibroker] Re:
Trading mutual funds...That's because they're going
short on underlying securities,right, or did you mean something else?.
Can you actually "go short" on a MF itself, or is that a
no-no?--- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Chuck Rademacher"
<chuck_rademacher@x> wrote:> Jitu,> > You may
not be aware, but there are some mutual funds (Rydex, ProFunds)
that> when you "buy" them, you are effectively taking on a "short"
position.> -----Original
Message-----> From: jtelang
[mailto:jtelang@xxxx]> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2003
10:11 PM> To: amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [amibroker] Re: Trading mutual funds...> >
> Fred,> > From this, do I
understand it correctly that one can't go> short on MF's?
Why would one be sitting on cash otherwise?> Or may be I'm
not following what you said below...> > Jitu>
> --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Fred"
<fctonetti@xxxx> wrote:> > One other note
regarding short term trading ... There are of course>
> ways to accomplish the same thing with out actually taking
the> short> > term trades i.e. by
hedging using a bear oriented fund leaving you> >
more or less market neutral during the period of time when
you> would> > have been sitting in
cash.> >> > --- In
amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Fred" <fctonetti@xxxx>
wrote:> > > See below ...> >
>> > > --- In amibroker@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, "Chuck
Rademacher"> > > <chuck_rademacher@x>
wrote:> > > > Maybe some of you guys (and gals)
who trade mutual funds can> > answer>
> > a couple> > > > of
questions?> > > >> > >
> 1. If there's no money to be made in (rotational trading
of)> > > ETF's, am I> >
> > correct when I assume that there's no money to be made in
the> > Rydex-> > >
like> > > > funds that only mimic an
index?> > > >> >
>> > > Rydex's funds are pretty much either index
or sector oriented.> > This> >
> is not the kind of thing I personally like to trade. But
for> > example> > > if you have
a system that trades SPX, NDX or RUT well or is good>
at> > > jumping on the sector that's likely to be hot
next as opposed to> > the> >
> one that just was then it would certainly work in this
scenario.> > >> > > >
2. Based on current rules and redemption penalties,
which> > families> > >
of> > > > mutual funds can you recommend for
rotational trading?> > > >>
> >> > > I don't personally trade on what one
would consider to be a> > > rotational basis.
As I and Ken stated, erf's or the funds> >
management> > > policies will eventually weed out
most if not all the short term> > > traders,
especially the ones with large dollars. So if you
are> > > looking to trade mf's with some sort of
short term oriented> > > rotational system as opposed
to one that trades on an> intermediate>
> > basis picking good candidates at the beginning of a market
buy> and> > > for the most part
holding them until a market sell then you are> >
going> > > to find yourself pretty much limited to
Rydex, ProFunds & Potomac.> >
>> > > > 3. If most (or all) such
families of funds charge early> >
redemption> > > fees, is> >
> > it safe to assume that you are trading these mid to long
term?> > > >> > >
> There's no sense in me working on a system that appears to
do> > well,> > > only
to> > > > find that redemption fees are going to
kill me. Or, is it> > > possible
that> > > > there's enough money to be made that
the fees are of little> > >
consequence?> > > >> >
>> > > Most do NOT yet charge erf's and as you can
see from prior posts> > it's>
> > debatable as to whether or not they will and if so what
the> minimum> > > holding periods
will be to trigger those. For short term>
oriented> > > traders adding a 1-2% erf in a 7-14 day
period would be enough to> > > send them
elsewhere or to a different methodology. What the
SEC> or> > > the fund
companies themselves will do with this remains to be> >
seen.> > > They really can't afford to be too
outrageous with it as every> > > 401k/IRA/VA account
holder on the planet will be screaming bloody> >
> murder.> > >> > > >
Out of all of the above, I'm really interested in some>
> > recommendations on> > > > mutual fund
families to trade. I can then go do my own> > >
investigation as to> > > > their fees, etc and
devise my own systems that will work with> >
those> > > fees.> > >
>> > >> > > I wouldn't
think families as there is no real reason to just like>
> > there is no real reason to arbitrarilly limit ones trading
in> > stocks> > > to some
specific group based on whatever.> >
>> > > > Thanks> >
> Yahoo! Groups
Sponsor>
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